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bekcat1
Joined: 24 Feb 2011
Posts: 874
Location: The ATL
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 Posted: 05/21/15 12:49 pm ::: |
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| #Occasionalwnbafan wrote: |
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2UQ_VAonFsY
Diamond sounds like a very nice young lady, not sure why she is disliked by so many people, all the talk about being a bad teammate and stuff seems like nonsense to me. |
In all fairness, she did show a little attitude when she was at UNC. Looking back, I can kind of see why. What no one could ever question then or now is that she was/is a great teammate. She's a bright young lady, and she'll do an outstanding job representing Tennessee (she already has, representing the SEC in that NCAA committee).
With some folks, no matter how much she shines on and off the court, the impression they have of her won't change. See the Dream thread and the discussion about Shoni for an example of that.
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willtalk
Joined: 13 Apr 2012
Posts: 1097
Location: NorCal
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| Posted: 05/21/15 10:36 pm ::: |
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| ArtBest23 wrote: |
| willtalk wrote: |
| the reason that they held combined try outs was because they wanted to create more of a balance between the two teams. |
Do you have a source for this, because it's certainly not obvious from the selections. |
I could as well say Doe's anyone have a source to validate that the Pan Am Team is the MAIN Team. I will however give my reasons for the perspective that impelled my response. It's based on certain quotes by the committee, history and just plain common sense.
The committee stated before the selections even began their rational for the unified selection process was that they felt they had enough talent to put together two rather than one team. Logistically they could have just created one team and had them represent the US at both events.
The next question that comes up is if their would be any logical reason to create an top loaded and a lesser team. Does the USA really need to stack the deck to win in the Pan Am Games? Is the competition that much better at the Pan Am Games than at the Worlds
The first question is in reference to how good are the teams really at the Pan Am Games. Some might be influenced by the fact that the US team finished 7th at the last 2011 games. As has been pointed out that had more to do with the really weak team that went rather than the strength of the two teams they lost too. Both games they lost ( Porto Rico-the eventual winner) and Argentina were close games lost in the last min. They came back and rolled over their next opposition. The most dominate player who set a lot of Pan Am records was Stewart ( then in high school ). Those teams were not that good.
Conversely the World team had Dela Don, both Ogwumike's, Diggens, Sims, Strinckland Johnson, etc. The dominated the other teams except for Australia who played them tough until the last Q. The competitiveness of the games in 2011 against the US teams could not be used as a measure of the relative strength of the opposition at the different venues. The World team had WNBA quality players where as the Pam AM was really weak. Steward did better against the teams she faced than she did as a frosh against college competition
My contention is that the Pan Am competition is not as tough as some of you might believe and there is no reason to load up the team that faces them. Conversely the World competition is not as weak in comparison with the Pan Am teams as many of you might believe. The USA is not a lock to win with a subpar team. The Aussies are always tough as evidenced by how they played against that loaded World team in 2011.
The committee also stated they were not looking to put together an AllSar roster but players that could play together. To judge the teams based purely on your individual perspective would not be the same criteria the committee used. Was anyone on this site present at and watched the try outs?. So assuming that one team is the Main while the other the second string would be based purely on national rep. Just because Stewart is on one team would not necessarily make it the A team. They are not going to sacrifice The World Games for The Pan Am Games. They have enough talent to send two teams that can dominate both contests. They sent a subpar team to the Pan Am games in 2011 but that was beyond their control. They are not going to take a chance and do the same thing this and lose again this year. They want to win both.
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 05/22/15 10:35 am ::: |
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| willtalk wrote: |
The next question that comes up is if their would be any logical reason to create an top loaded and a lesser team. Does the USA really need to stack the deck to win in the Pan Am Games? Is the competition that much better at the Pan Am Games than at the Worlds
Worlds. |
Actually if you read the thread, several people have provided the reasons for why the PAG was given higher priority, and a simple perusal of the rosters manifests that it was.
Last edited by ArtBest23 on 05/22/15 5:48 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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willtalk
Joined: 13 Apr 2012
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Location: NorCal
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| Posted: 05/22/15 5:17 pm ::: |
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| ArtBest23 wrote: |
Actually if you read the thread, several people have provided the reasons for why the PAG was given higher priority, and a simple perusal of the rosters manifests that it was. |
I did read the thread and gave my response to those reasons. Mainly that the loss by the team in the 2011 Pan Am games did not justify the perspective that the teams in the Pan Am games were vastly superior. Perhaps what we are are in disagreement about is just what is meant by the "Main Team". Does that imply that the World Team is comprised of the second group of twelve? I just don't think the Pan Am Teams are that strong. The World Team would win there as well. I would not argue that the PA Team is probably better. That's mainly because they have Stewart. One other poster stated that she was heads and shoulders above every other player. It would then be impossible to make the teams equal. They might just have put Stewart on the Pan Am team because she holds records at those games. Although I think the player who was truly heads and shoulders abover everyone was 6'9" Mulkey lol.
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 05/22/15 5:46 pm ::: |
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| willtalk wrote: |
| ArtBest23 wrote: |
Actually if you read the thread, several people have provided the reasons for why the PAG was given higher priority, and a simple perusal of the rosters manifests that it was. |
I did read the thread and gave my response to those reasons. Mainly that the loss by the team in the 2011 Pan Am games did not justify the perspective that the teams in the Pan Am games were vastly superior. Perhaps what we are are in disagreement about is just what is meant by the "Main Team". Does that imply that the World Team is comprised of the second group of twelve? I just don't think the Pan Am Teams are that strong. The World Team would win there as well. I would not argue that the PA Team is probably better. That's mainly because they have Stewart. One other poster stated that she was heads and shoulders above every other player. It would then be impossible to make the teams equal. They might just have put Stewart on the Pan Am team because she holds records at those games. Although I think the player who was truly heads and shoulders abover everyone was 6'9" Mulkey lol. |
As I said in the other thread, the two biggest names on the WUG team haven't played in a year and consequently I doubt they would beat out the PAG roster. Davis is the only player that I am surprised is not on the PAG roster.
I don't think the two rosters are even remotely equal. It is more likely than not that they held a joint tryout to have the largest pool, selected the PAG roster first, and then selected the WUG roster.
What is your vision of this, that the two head coaches took turns picking players for their teams? I don't believe the results suport that theory.
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awhom111
Joined: 19 Nov 2014
Posts: 4231
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| Posted: 05/22/15 8:40 pm ::: |
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| willtalk wrote: |
| ArtBest23 wrote: |
Actually if you read the thread, several people have provided the reasons for why the PAG was given higher priority, and a simple perusal of the rosters manifests that it was. |
I did read the thread and gave my response to those reasons. Mainly that the loss by the team in the 2011 Pan Am games did not justify the perspective that the teams in the Pan Am games were vastly superior. Perhaps what we are are in disagreement about is just what is meant by the "Main Team". Does that imply that the World Team is comprised of the second group of twelve? I just don't think the Pan Am Teams are that strong. The World Team would win there as well. I would not argue that the PA Team is probably better. That's mainly because they have Stewart. One other poster stated that she was heads and shoulders above every other player. It would then be impossible to make the teams equal. They might just have put Stewart on the Pan Am team because she holds records at those games. Although I think the player who was truly heads and shoulders abover everyone was 6'9" Mulkey lol. |
If you are expecting someone official to actually explain the process, I doubt that you will be satisfied. They would not want to do that and not enough people care to force an explanation. It seems that most people think that the Pan Am team is stronger, so it is probably stronger.
The World University Games team would have absolutely no shot at winning the Pan Am Games gold. Frankly, I am not sure how big of a chance this team has either. The other seven teams will have close to their full strength teams since Olympic qualifiers are soon after they finish. Cuba (the defending champions of the Americas), Canada (helped by home court advantage), and Brazil (even without the WNBA players) are all capable of beating any group of American collegians.
I would handicap the World University Games at about 49% US, 48% Australia, and 3% the field at this point. The issue in that tournament is that you invariably play some teams that are completely terrible.
Speaking of Australia, their preliminary roster of 19 + injured Rebecca Cole is here:
http://www.basketball.net.au/2015-world-university-games-womens-squad-announced/
I guess Brendan Joyce is actually taking charge of this team and Andrej Lemanis is pulling double duty on the Men's side too? Maybe one of the Australian posters can wander in and offer some input.
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 15739
Location: OREGON (in my heart)
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| Posted: 05/22/15 11:43 pm ::: |
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| ArtBest23 wrote: |
| I don't think the two rosters are even remotely equal. It is more likely than not that they held a joint tryout to have the largest pool, selected the PAG roster first, and then selected the WUG roster. |
Ya, that Pan Am team might not see any close games, really. (wait....does Brazil go all out for the PAG?)
The University Team is nicely talented, but not equal to the Pan Am team.
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PhillyCat
Joined: 18 Jun 2012
Posts: 226
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| Posted: 05/26/15 12:11 pm ::: |
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UConn beat writer Carl Adamec was out in Colorado Springs and asked Carol Callan about dividing the talent between the Pan Am and WUGs teams. Carol answers very tactfully:
There were a total of 24 college players picked to play for Team USA in the World University Games and Pan-American Games at trials (May 14-17). How was it decided which players would play for which team to make them most competitive in those events?
Callan: “Initially, I thought it would be really difficult because both coaches (WUG coach Joe McKeown and Pan-Am coach Lisa Bluder) want to do their own draft yet it’s up to the selection committee to make sure that players are in the places where they’re going to contribute most to a team. It really would be counter-productive to say we’ll stack one team and not the other. In consultation with the coaches in terms of what they were looking for, I think the committee did a great job putting two competitive teams together. Our competition at the Pan-Am Games are national teams because they have an Olympic qualifier in Edmonton in August. You look at that and there are more experienced teams there. But I’d love to see our WUG and Pan-Am Games teams play each other and see who would win.” (emphasis added)
http://snyuconn.com/uconn/5-questions-with-usa-basketballs-carol-callan-3/
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Nixtreefan
Joined: 14 Nov 2012
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
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Location: OREGON (in my heart)
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dtrain34
Joined: 17 Aug 2010
Posts: 409
Location: Lacey, Washington
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| Posted: 05/27/15 11:27 pm ::: |
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| Never mind. Responded to a post thinking it was the last one, but I guess it was way back from weeks ago!
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awhom111
Joined: 19 Nov 2014
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GEF34
Joined: 23 Jul 2008
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| Posted: 06/04/15 9:45 pm ::: |
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Canada has brought in a nice group of players to tryout for the team. I will be interested in seeing this team develop, there is some good young talent, especially with the post players that I think have the potential to be part of the future of Canada's senior national team for many years and join the core they are already starting to develop.
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linkster
Joined: 27 Jul 2012
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| Posted: 06/11/15 7:18 pm ::: |
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Nine have died and thousands have been quarantined in a MERS outbreak in S Korea.
Is it really wise to attend the WUG's when millions are avoiding trips to Korea?
Last edited by linkster on 06/18/15 11:32 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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awhom111
Joined: 19 Nov 2014
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Conway Gamecock
Joined: 23 Jan 2015
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Location: Here
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| Posted: 06/18/15 9:43 pm ::: |
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| linkster wrote: |
Nine have died and thousands have been guaranteed in a MERS outbreak in S Korea.
Is it really wise to attend the WUG's when millions are avoiding trips to Korea? |
Guaranteed to do what? To die? Or did you mean quarantined??
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linkster
Joined: 27 Jul 2012
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| Posted: 06/18/15 11:36 pm ::: |
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| Conway Gamecock wrote: |
| linkster wrote: |
Nine have died and thousands have been guaranteed in a MERS outbreak in S Korea.
Is it really wise to attend the WUG's when millions are avoiding trips to Korea? |
Guaranteed to do what? To die? Or did you mean quarantined?? |
Guess. LOL That's what I get for not wearing glasses when using spell check.
BTW the death toll is now 24. 6000 are currently quarantined.
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
Posts: 7845
Location: Shenandoah Valley
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| Posted: 06/19/15 9:54 am ::: |
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| linkster wrote: |
| Conway Gamecock wrote: |
| linkster wrote: |
Nine have died and thousands have been guaranteed in a MERS outbreak in S Korea.
Is it really wise to attend the WUG's when millions are avoiding trips to Korea? |
Guaranteed to do what? To die? Or did you mean quarantined?? |
Guess. LOL That's what I get for not wearing glasses when using spell check.
BTW the death toll is now 24. 6000 are currently quarantined. |
A lot of the uproar and fear is unfounded. MERS is an opportunistic virus and attacks primarily people who are already compromised. It has spread through *close contact* such as caring for people who are ill in home or healthcare settings. Researchers studying MERS have not seen any ongoing spreading of MERS in the community. Routine preventative measures are advised, such as hand washing or the use of hand sanitizer, covering the nose and mouth when coughing or sneezing, avoiding contact with sick persons, etc.
In other words, QUIT FREAKING OUT!
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It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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awhom111
Joined: 19 Nov 2014
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Durantula
Joined: 30 Mar 2013
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awhom111
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| Posted: 06/22/15 11:30 pm ::: |
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On the men's side we have only won gold once since the turn of the century while we have been the dominant force on the women's side, so I think that they did not worry about trying something new. Using one collegiate team for their overseas trip is not uncommon for USA team sports in this event, but this is only the second time it has been done for Men's Basketball. The problem is that the combination of early entry and players not really caring about this event has really diminished the quality of players available. Collegiate men are allowed to try out for the Pan-Am team (along with current non-NBA pros) so if they want to represent the country, they still have the chance to do so (some are still young enough for the U19s too).
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Durantula
Joined: 30 Mar 2013
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| Posted: 06/23/15 5:52 pm ::: |
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| awhom111 wrote: |
On the men's side we have only won gold once since the turn of the century while we have been the dominant force on the women's side, so I think that they did not worry about trying something new. Using one collegiate team for their overseas trip is not uncommon for USA team sports in this event, but this is only the second time it has been done for Men's Basketball. The problem is that the combination of early entry and players not really caring about this event has really diminished the quality of players available. Collegiate men are allowed to try out for the Pan-Am team (along with current non-NBA pros) so if they want to represent the country, they still have the chance to do so (some are still young enough for the U19s too). |
Did any non WNBA pros try out for the women's Pan Am team, or do they restrict it just to college?
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awhom111
Joined: 19 Nov 2014
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| Posted: 06/23/15 8:37 pm ::: |
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| Durantula wrote: |
| awhom111 wrote: |
On the men's side we have only won gold once since the turn of the century while we have been the dominant force on the women's side, so I think that they did not worry about trying something new. Using one collegiate team for their overseas trip is not uncommon for USA team sports in this event, but this is only the second time it has been done for Men's Basketball. The problem is that the combination of early entry and players not really caring about this event has really diminished the quality of players available. Collegiate men are allowed to try out for the Pan-Am team (along with current non-NBA pros) so if they want to represent the country, they still have the chance to do so (some are still young enough for the U19s too). |
Did any non WNBA pros try out for the women's Pan Am team, or do they restrict it just to college? |
The Women's Pan Am team was restricted to collegians. I actually did a thought experiment question on that thread about whether you could hypothetically make a better team of non-WNBA pros, but nobody responded.
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awhom111
Joined: 19 Nov 2014
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| Posted: 07/03/15 11:42 am ::: |
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The team has arrived in South Korea and had two exhibitions. They beat Russia 71-58 and Canada 68-51.
The opener against Italy will be on ESPNU at 9:00pm EDT on Saturday.
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 07/03/15 11:51 pm ::: |
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I'm not clear on this. Just who is eligible for the WUG? Don't you have to be a university student and 24 years old or less?
In the men's game tonight against Turkey, the announcers said the average age of the Turkish team is 26. Can that be right?
Turkey was supposed to be one of the two favorites, along with Brazil, in the US's group, but the US (after trailing by double digits in the first half) won by 9, 66-57.
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