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GEF34
Joined: 23 Jul 2008
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 Posted: 04/08/15 11:14 pm ::: |
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| Rock Hard wrote: |
| Loyd's life is not over just because she left school early. She has one year left to get her degree. She can go to any university of her choice whenever she decides to go back to school and complete her last two semesters. She can decide what year she does not want to play overseas and go to school that year. Going back to school after working for awhile is not difficult or impossible. The real difficulties of going back to college arises if a person gets married and has several children. |
I agree completely (well except about the marriage part, I have no comment on that). And why is it whenever a person has finished their 4 years of athletic eligibility, but still has classes to take to graduate, no one ever says it's a bad decision to play pro, or says they don't care about getting a degree. To me there is no difference, the person is still leaving the school before they have a degree.
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GEF34
Joined: 23 Jul 2008
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| Posted: 04/08/15 11:16 pm ::: |
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| summertime blues wrote: |
| GEF34 wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
| GEF34 wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
| GEF34 wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
| I'm not assuming she isn't going to get her degree, for those of you who commented. I am, however, speaking from experience in that it's harder to come back and get a degree once you have been out and working for awhile, no matter what that work is. It's hard to change focus. Been there, done that. |
So you are calling her decision a "stupid move" based on what exactly...
Since you apparently don't know anything about her, her graduation status, her desires, her plans for next year, how can you make such a harsh judgement on her decision. Not to mention you also said "apparently she hasn't yet figured out the importance of a degree" when you have no idea how important a degree is to her. And this decision doesn't tell you anything about how important a degree is to her. |
I said it was my *opinion* and in another post which you quoted but obviously didn't bother to READ said that it was based on my *experience*. Granted, everyone's experience will not be the same but I have seen similar cases often enough that I know it to be valid for quite a number of people. I still maintain that education should come first. Sorry if you disagree. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. |
So based on your experience you can tell if something is important to her... |
Based on your observation, I can tell that you are choosing to be willfully obtuse.  |
Right, because I'm not willing to just call a person's decision stupid and make judgments about what is important to them, that makes me slow to understand.
BTW you still haven't proven you know anything about this person you have made such harsh judgments about, and yet you stand by those judgments. |
You really should go sit with the other nit-pickers and debate about angels standing on the heads of pins. You don't seem to understand that saying "in my opinion, that is a stupid decision" is NOT the same as judging a person. It is merely stating one's opinion. Period. And why have you got your knickers in such a knot over someone else's opinion? Have you nothing better to occupy your mind? |
You're right, you are not passing judgment, by saying "your opinion" it makes it ok to say whatever you want about a person you know nothing about.
That is the part that is bothering me, everyone things they can be rude to someone as long as they say "just my opinion" or "just kidding" and it suppose to somehow make their statement less rude.
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
Posts: 7821
Location: Shenandoah Valley
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| Posted: 04/08/15 11:24 pm ::: |
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| GEF34 wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
| GEF34 wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
| GEF34 wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
| GEF34 wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
| I'm not assuming she isn't going to get her degree, for those of you who commented. I am, however, speaking from experience in that it's harder to come back and get a degree once you have been out and working for awhile, no matter what that work is. It's hard to change focus. Been there, done that. |
So you are calling her decision a "stupid move" based on what exactly...
Since you apparently don't know anything about her, her graduation status, her desires, her plans for next year, how can you make such a harsh judgement on her decision. Not to mention you also said "apparently she hasn't yet figured out the importance of a degree" when you have no idea how important a degree is to her. And this decision doesn't tell you anything about how important a degree is to her. |
I said it was my *opinion* and in another post which you quoted but obviously didn't bother to READ said that it was based on my *experience*. Granted, everyone's experience will not be the same but I have seen similar cases often enough that I know it to be valid for quite a number of people. I still maintain that education should come first. Sorry if you disagree. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. |
So based on your experience you can tell if something is important to her... |
Based on your observation, I can tell that you are choosing to be willfully obtuse. |
Right, because I'm not willing to just call a person's decision stupid and make judgments about what is important to them, that makes me slow to understand.
BTW you still haven't proven you know anything about this person you have made such harsh judgments about, and yet you stand by those judgments. |
You really should go sit with the other nit-pickers and debate about angels standing on the heads of pins. You don't seem to understand that saying "in my opinion, that is a stupid decision" is NOT the same as judging a person. It is merely stating one's opinion. Period. And why have you got your knickers in such a knot over someone else's opinion? Have you nothing better to occupy your mind? |
You're right, you are not passing judgment, by saying "your opinion" it makes it ok to say whatever you want about a person you know nothing about.
That is the part that is bothering me, everyone things they can be rude to someone as long as they say "just my opinion" or "just kidding" and it suppose to somehow make their statement less rude. |
And being online makes it all right for YOU to be rude to someone whose opinion you happen to disagree with, obviously, and tell them they are being judgmental etc.
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Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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PhillyCat
Joined: 18 Jun 2012
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| Posted: 04/08/15 11:31 pm ::: |
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We now know what Skylar Diggins thinks:
Skylar Diggins @SkyDigg4 · 25m 25 minutes ago
The four years I spent as a student-athlete at the University of Notre Dame were the best years of my life.
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GEF34
Joined: 23 Jul 2008
Posts: 14109
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| Posted: 04/08/15 11:32 pm ::: |
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| summertime blues wrote: |
| GEF34 wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
You really should go sit with the other nit-pickers and debate about angels standing on the heads of pins. You don't seem to understand that saying "in my opinion, that is a stupid decision" is NOT the same as judging a person. It is merely stating one's opinion. Period. And why have you got your knickers in such a knot over someone else's opinion? Have you nothing better to occupy your mind? |
You're right, you are not passing judgment, by saying "your opinion" it makes it ok to say whatever you want about a person you know nothing about.
That is the part that is bothering me, everyone things they can be rude to someone as long as they say "just my opinion" or "just kidding" and it suppose to somehow make their statement less rude. |
And being online makes it all right for YOU to be rude to someone whose opinion you happen to disagree with, obviously, and tell them they are being judgmental etc. |
Given that you are making a harsh judgment what word should I use to describe what you are doing? The definition of judgmental is making a harsh judgment, do you have another word for making a harsh judgment that I should use? And you calling her decision is a "stupid move" and saying "she hasn't figured out the importance of a degree" is a harsh judgment.
And I don't recall in any of our exchanges, today or any other days, being rude to you. There have been times when I intended to be sarcastic in response to what I took as sarcasm from you.
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Fighting Artichoke
Joined: 12 Dec 2012
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| Posted: 04/08/15 11:38 pm ::: |
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| Durantula wrote: |
| Fighting Artichoke wrote: |
| NoDakSt wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
| Stupid move, IMO, but whatever. It won't be so easy to finish school once she's done the pro thing, and apparently she hasn't yet figured out the importance of a degree. But best of luck to her anyway. |
Whoa, whoa. Why the assumption she is t goi g to get her degree? |
Jewell has only been at ND for 3 years, so it is VERY unlikely that she has enough credits for graduation.
ND is truly going to miss her next year. I wish Jewell the best but I really wish she had chosen to stay. I guess this is just more good news for UConn fans. |
She could be pretty close though, right? I thought freshmen come to college a little early in the summer to take credits and then they are on campus each summer taking a few classes. Wish she stayed in school but the common thought is she is a full year away from a degree and I'd assume she is a little closer. |
Not necessarily. Most ND undergrads take at least 15 credits/semester, so almost everyone graduates in 4 years, unlike many state schools, where many students take 12-14 credits/semester and have difficulty getting into certain classes, as freshmen are usually the last to register. (If they cannot take prereqs, they fall behind in getting started on majors classes). But athletes at Notre Dame usually take fewer credits during the semester of their sport (e.g., football players take only 12 credits (the minimum # of credits to be considered a fulltime student) during fall semester because of football). Since basketball runs across semesters, I would guess that basketball players take only 12 credits/semester. They graduate on time anyway because they take summer school classes. The summer classes at ND also allow them to be on campus to engage in some off-season activities such as weightlifting. Unless Jewell came in with a bucketful of advanced placement credits from high school, there is no way she is close to graduating in just 3 years. I know I only was credited with 8 credits of Calculus when I arrived in South Bend, and I came from a pretty good school. One of my friends DID graduate in 3 years at ND due to a bevy of advanced placement credits. I took 4 years but had extra credits from taking more than 15 credits some semesters.
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Fighting Artichoke
Joined: 12 Dec 2012
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| Posted: 04/08/15 11:58 pm ::: |
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I am a Notre Dame fan and I am very shocked and saddened by Jewell's decision. Obviously, she had a change of heart some time in the past 2 weeks, as she was emphatic before that she was not considering leaving. Obviously her teammates were shocked by her decision as well. It would not surprise me if they felt betrayed -- if not by her decision -- by the way in which it came out of nowhere. Clearly Muffet, Chris Masters (ND's media relations) and her teammates were assured by her that she was returning to the team.
Despite being saddened and shocked, I realize it's HER decision and not anyone else's. I will treasure the memory of her 3 seasons in South Bend, yet I will lament her early departure to the pro ranks when the team was primed for an amazing season. Good luck, Jewell. I do not fully understand your decision, but I wish you the best.
I also fear this resets an ugly precedent for the women's game. I hope no other player only 3 years out of high school opts to go pro, so Jewell's decision will be anomalous, like Prince's). (Somehow I view the Zahui B. decision differently, perhaps because she is foreign. Was she only 3 years out of high school?)
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 04/09/15 12:55 am ::: |
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I disagree completely that she can't be close to graduating. Basketball players routinely graduated in four year before the fairly recent rule changes permitting a basketball scholarship to cover summers including the summer before the usual start of freshman year. The summers easily allow someone to gain a semester or more. Because of summers plenty of football players finish in three and a half so they spend the final spring training full time for the combine and NFL workouts and camps.
And if she needs more school, she can follow Troy Murphy's lead. Murphy was a 1st team AA, and 2 time BE POY who left ND after his junior year as the 1st round pick of Golden State. He made nearly $70 million in 12 NBA seasons. Now he is back in school at Columbia finishing his degree (and carrying a 3.8 GPA)..
I think college is a great time of your life, but it's her call, and I wish her the best in her decision. I don't know her family or financial situation or what opportunities she sees. The hype will be about Stewart next year, this may increase her endorsement opportunities as the star of this class.
In the end it is entirely her decision and anyone on a message board speaking from total ignorance about her own personal situation is way out of line in criticizing it.
Nobody criticizes any men in any sport for leaving early these days. Heck, three years is hardly considered "early" any more. It's "old" for MBB players headed to the NBA. So why should a star WBB player get criticized for the same decision?
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GEF34
Joined: 23 Jul 2008
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tfan
Joined: 31 May 2010
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| Posted: 04/09/15 1:55 am ::: |
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| Fighting Artichoke wrote: |
| (Somehow I view the Zahui B. decision differently, perhaps because she is foreign. Was she only 3 years out of high school?) |
Yes, she graduated from Igelstavikens Gymnasium in Sweden in 2012.
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GlennMacGrady
Joined: 03 Jan 2005
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Location: Heisenberg
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| Posted: 04/09/15 2:12 am ::: |
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| Fighting Artichoke wrote: |
Obviously, she had a change of heart some time in the past 2 weeks, as she was emphatic before that she was not considering leaving.
I do not fully understand your decision
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I'll elaborate what I suggested earlier as a causative factor: UConn.
Loyd has just lost the National Championship again to UConn and every major award to Stewart. She looks at next season and, like many pundits and fans, sees the same scenario repeating itself.
Therefore, she objectively calculates that, because of UConn, there are no sufficiently probable big "carrots" left if she stays in college -- nothing other than a repeat of what she's already accomplished twice: first team AA status on a National Champion runner-up.
The carrots of pro ball are immediate and a certainty. The balance in her mind tips. |
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tfan
Joined: 31 May 2010
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| Posted: 04/09/15 3:24 am ::: |
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| GlennMacGrady wrote: |
| Fighting Artichoke wrote: |
Obviously, she had a change of heart some time in the past 2 weeks, as she was emphatic before that she was not considering leaving.
I do not fully understand your decision
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I'll elaborate what I suggested earlier as a causative factor: UConn.
Loyd has just lost the National Championship again to UConn and every major award to Stewart. She looks at next season and, like many pundits and fans, sees the same scenario repeating itself.
Therefore, she objectively calculates that, because of UConn, there are no sufficiently probable big "carrots" left if she stays in college -- nothing other than a repeat of what she's already accomplished twice: first team AA status on a National Champion runner-up.
The carrots of pro ball are immediate and a certainty. The balance in her mind tips. |
She may also consider the strong possibility of her "best case NCAA tournament scenario" being - losing at the Final Four to UConn for a fourth year in a row, and to UConn in the Championship game for the 3rd year in a row, a "stick", that is, something she doesn't want to experience.
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cthskzfn
Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 12851
Location: In a world where a PSYCHOpath like Trump isn't potus.
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| Posted: 04/09/15 5:03 am ::: |
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| ArtBest23 wrote: |
I disagree completely that she can't be close to graduating. Basketball players routinely graduated in four year before the fairly recent rule changes permitting a basketball scholarship to cover summers including the summer before the usual start of freshman year. The summers easily allow someone to gain a semester or more. Because of summers plenty of football players finish in three and a half so they spend the final spring training full time for the combine and NFL workouts and camps.
And if she needs more school, she can follow Troy Murphy's lead. Murphy was a 1st team AA, and 2 time BE POY who left ND after his junior year as the 1st round pick of Golden State. He made nearly $70 million in 12 NBA seasons. Now he is back in school at Columbia finishing his degree (and carrying a 3.8 GPA)..
I think college is a great time of your life, but it's her call, and I wish her the best in her decision. I don't know her family or financial situation or what opportunities she sees. The hype will be about Stewart next year, this may increase her endorsement opportunities as the star of this class.
In the end it is entirely her decision and anyone on a message board speaking from total ignorance about her own personal situation is way out of line in criticizing it.
Nobody criticizes any men in any sport for leaving early these days. Heck, three years is hardly considered "early" any more. It's "old" for MBB players headed to the NBA. So why should a star WBB player get criticized for the same decision? |
How about ex-irish? Are they way out of line as well?
Devereaux Peters @MsPeters14
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So many thoughts man. So sad and misguided, but to each her own I guess....
9:54 PM - 8 Apr 2015
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Luuuc
#NATC
Joined: 10 Feb 2005
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| Posted: 04/09/15 5:34 am ::: |
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| cthskzfn wrote: |
| ArtBest23 wrote: |
I disagree completely that she can't be close to graduating. Basketball players routinely graduated in four year before the fairly recent rule changes permitting a basketball scholarship to cover summers including the summer before the usual start of freshman year. The summers easily allow someone to gain a semester or more. Because of summers plenty of football players finish in three and a half so they spend the final spring training full time for the combine and NFL workouts and camps.
And if she needs more school, she can follow Troy Murphy's lead. Murphy was a 1st team AA, and 2 time BE POY who left ND after his junior year as the 1st round pick of Golden State. He made nearly $70 million in 12 NBA seasons. Now he is back in school at Columbia finishing his degree (and carrying a 3.8 GPA)..
I think college is a great time of your life, but it's her call, and I wish her the best in her decision. I don't know her family or financial situation or what opportunities she sees. The hype will be about Stewart next year, this may increase her endorsement opportunities as the star of this class.
In the end it is entirely her decision and anyone on a message board speaking from total ignorance about her own personal situation is way out of line in criticizing it.
Nobody criticizes any men in any sport for leaving early these days. Heck, three years is hardly considered "early" any more. It's "old" for MBB players headed to the NBA. So why should a star WBB player get criticized for the same decision? |
How about ex-irish? Are they way out of line as well?
Devereaux Peters @MsPeters14
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So many thoughts man. So sad and misguided, but to each her own I guess....
9:54 PM - 8 Apr 2015 |
I would say yes, it is way out of line for Dev to call Jewell misguided.
But each to my own I guess.
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 04/09/15 6:30 am ::: |
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| GlennMacGrady wrote: |
| Fighting Artichoke wrote: |
Obviously, she had a change of heart some time in the past 2 weeks, as she was emphatic before that she was not considering leaving.
I do not fully understand your decision
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I'll elaborate what I suggested earlier as a causative factor: UConn.
Loyd has just lost the National Championship again to UConn and every major award to Stewart. She looks at next season and, like many pundits and fans, sees the same scenario repeating itself.
Therefore, she objectively calculates that, because of UConn, there are no sufficiently probable big "carrots" left if she stays in college -- nothing other than a repeat of what she's already accomplished twice: first team AA status on a National Champion runner-up.
The carrots of pro ball are immediate and a certainty. The balance in her mind tips. |
You should post that on the Boneyard. They'd love you for it. They're big on "the world revolves around UConn" fiction over there.
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Hoops9092
Joined: 04 Nov 2008
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| Posted: 04/09/15 11:01 am ::: |
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I actually agree with what GlennMacGrady is saying and I am in no way a UConn fan.
Plus, I think South Carolina and Tennessee with Diamond potentially come back stronger and more explosive then Notre Dame next year even with Jewell.
If she feels it's time to move-on then so be it. I don't blame her.
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Ex-Ref
Joined: 04 Oct 2009
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| Posted: 04/09/15 11:02 am ::: |
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Without hearing from Jewel about why she's leaving I have some pretty harsh thoughts on it. Maybe if I hear a really good reason, IMO a really good reason, I'll change my mind. Here's what I'm thinking right now.
It seems like she's throwing away what could be a great legacy at ND for some quick money.
She would go down as one of the most beloved and honored athletes at ND. They'd put her number in the rafters and she'd have a place in the record books (and hearts of ND fans) for a long time.
Now, not so much.
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SueFavor
Joined: 20 May 2013
Posts: 387
Location: Los Angeles, CA
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| Posted: 04/09/15 11:19 am ::: |
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Why all the judgement?
Why not take the facts just as they are?
Jewell Loyd did not ask any of you for your opinions on her decision._________________ hoopism.blogspot.com
womenshoopsworld.com
twitter.com/hoopism
whoopsworld@aol.com |
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#Occasionalwnbafan
Joined: 01 Mar 2012
Posts: 1380
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| Posted: 04/09/15 11:23 am ::: |
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| PhillyCat wrote: |
We now know what Skylar Diggins thinks:
Skylar Diggins @SkyDigg4 · 25m 25 minutes ago
The four years I spent as a student-athlete at the University of Notre Dame were the best years of my life. |
It has nothing to do with her story which brought her to tears right?
http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=12623114
Last edited by #Occasionalwnbafan on 04/09/15 11:55 am; edited 1 time in total |
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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Ex-Ref
Joined: 04 Oct 2009
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| Posted: 04/09/15 11:30 am ::: |
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| Wonder if Natalie Achonwa's situation had anything to do with it?
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 04/09/15 11:35 am ::: |
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| SueFavor wrote: |
Why all the judgement?
Why not take the facts just as they are?
Jewell Loyd did not ask any of you for your opinions on her decision. |
+__________________________
The top ten college players in the NBA draft last year were all underclassmen. Did I miss the thread ripping Andrew Wiggins for his decision? What a bunch of hypocrites.
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ucbart
Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 2815
Location: New York
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| Posted: 04/09/15 11:37 am ::: |
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| SueFavor wrote: |
Why all the judgement?
Why not take the facts just as they are?
Jewell Loyd did not ask any of you for your opinions on her decision. |
I agree 110% People who excel leave places all the time for the better, in all facets of life. Jewell is clearly a highly talented, extremely gifted basketball player. She can choose to do whatever she wants. While I would be disappointed if a UCONN player did this, I would clearly understand. She has what, 12 years to make as much money as she can? She would be 23 when she was able to start making money and maybe she saw that. She can get her degree if she won't already graduate early(which is very possible). These women have to work around the year to make in a career what one mediocre NBA player makes in 3 years, why not maximize earnings? This had to be a very hard decision and I think this will make her some endorsement $$$. I think she should hire Kobe's agent, play that angle and start bringing in some cash.
I have a feeling she will have a change of heart and go back to ND for her senior year though in the next four days.
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
Posts: 7821
Location: Shenandoah Valley
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| Posted: 04/09/15 11:50 am ::: |
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| ArtBest23 wrote: |
| SueFavor wrote: |
Why all the judgement?
Why not take the facts just as they are?
Jewell Loyd did not ask any of you for your opinions on her decision. |
+__________________________
The top ten college players in the NBA draft last year were all underclassmen. Did I miss the thread ripping Andrew Wiggins for his decision? What a bunch of hypocrites. |
Rent-a-player has been a fact of life in MBB forever. So has the recruitment of academically poorly and unqualified male athletes, as the pro leagues use the colleges as their de facto minor leagues. WBB has always been different. Are we required to accept and approve this just because it is a "fact"? I don't approve of the way men's pro sports use the colleges so why should I approve of women's pro sport starting the same damn thing?
_________________
Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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ArtBest23
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