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pilight
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 Posted: 04/07/15 8:09 am ::: |
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| Last night's championship game should disabuse everyone of the notion that layups are just as high a percentage shot as dunks for college men.
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purduefanatic
Joined: 10 Aug 2011
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| Posted: 04/07/15 8:23 am ::: |
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And I know we like to complain about officiating in women's basketball, but that was some extremely poor whistle blowing down the stretch, all in favor of the coaching God known as Coach K.
1. A Duke player's finger clearly bends on replay, thus showing clearly that the ball hit him, yet even after review, the refs stick with the ball going to Duke. Huge call as Duke hit a '3' on that possession.
2. A minute prior to that, a Duke player was driving, stepped on the end line & bounced a couple of times on that foot before passing to Okafor. Okafor converted a layup and also got a foul called on Kaminshy of Wisconsin.
3. A minute or 2 before that, Winslow of Duke just flat out jumps in the air and runs over a Wisconsin defender (a play that is a charge and was called all year long in every game I saw). He passes and it leads to another '3'.
There were at least 2 other calls that were at worst 50/50 calls (leaned more towards Wisky guys) and they went the way of Duke.
Absolutely horrible officiating...and played a huge role in the outcome. I feel bad for Bo Ryan and the Badgers.
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005
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| Posted: 04/07/15 9:51 am ::: |
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| purduefanatic wrote: |
And I know we like to complain about officiating in women's basketball, but that was some extremely poor whistle blowing down the stretch, all in favor of the coaching God known as Coach K.
1. A Duke player's finger clearly bends on replay, thus showing clearly that the ball hit him, yet even after review, the refs stick with the ball going to Duke. Huge call as Duke hit a '3' on that possession.
2. A minute prior to that, a Duke player was driving, stepped on the end line & bounced a couple of times on that foot before passing to Okafor. Okafor converted a layup and also got a foul called on Kaminshy of Wisconsin.
3. A minute or 2 before that, Winslow of Duke just flat out jumps in the air and runs over a Wisconsin defender (a play that is a charge and was called all year long in every game I saw). He passes and it leads to another '3'.
There were at least 2 other calls that were at worst 50/50 calls (leaned more towards Wisky guys) and they went the way of Duke.
Absolutely horrible officiating...and played a huge role in the outcome. I feel bad for Bo Ryan and the Badgers. |
X__________
And those who think we can wave a magic wand and improve officiating in the women's game should take note: That was the biggest game for the men's side, those missed calls were big, big moments, and those refs were the best the men have.
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
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| Posted: 04/07/15 10:29 am ::: |
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| ISTM that as much basketball as I have watched this year, refs in the women's game are *slightly* more inclined to reverse calls on review than they are in men's games. Then Man suggests it may be an alpha male thing. It does not seem to apply in championshp games involving either sex, however.
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 04/07/15 10:58 am ::: |
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The officials didn't dictate the outcome of that game.
Duke's guards dictated the outcome of that game. That and Dekker playing like crap.
And Mike Krzyzewski outcoached Bo Ryan. Ryan's stubborn lack of adjustment to take advantage of Okafor and Winslow sitting on the bench in foul trouble for extended periods was inexplicable.
Believe me, I'm no Duke MBB fan. And Wiscy may have been the sentimental favorite. But Duke earned that championship.
Oh, and Ryan's post-game whining and "we don't do a rent-a-player" cracks were really unseemly sour grapes, particularly for a guy who usually exhibits class and sportsmanship.
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toad455
Joined: 16 Nov 2005
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| Posted: 04/07/15 11:07 am ::: |
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| yes, Dekker was terrible last night. And big Frank looked exhausted in the final 3-4 minutes, too. Regardless of the refs, Wisconsin seemed like they also ran out of steam in the end and got very sloppy with the ball.
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GlennMacGrady
Joined: 03 Jan 2005
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| Posted: 04/07/15 11:15 am ::: |
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Duke won the NC game with seven assists on 24 baskets, and four of those assists probably went to Duke's four made three-point shots. Probably only three assists by the national champion were scoring passes into the paint.
I think this is at least somewhat indicative of the lack of sophisticated team offense in MCBB, which focuses heavily on isolation plays and self-creations by big and fast athletes.
When such athletes were much rarer, you would see many more offensive explosions. There wouldn't be an Elgin Baylor today. That's also why girl's high school basketball is more exciting to watch than WCBB or WNBA basketball: you can often see players explode for monster offensive games.
I did like Frank Kaminsky and even his blue collar name. He could be a modern and taller Bevo Francis. |
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 04/07/15 11:27 am ::: |
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Per Twitter:
"Duke-Wisconsin on CBS banks a 17.1 rating/27 share, the highest figures since Arizona-Kentucky in 1997"
Guess MCBB must be doing something right.
Edit - here's the CBS press release - http://www.cbspressexpress.com/cbs-sports/releases/view?id=42346
They also had a record 3.4 million live video streams last night.
Last edited by ArtBest23 on 04/07/15 11:33 am; edited 1 time in total |
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purduefanatic
Joined: 10 Aug 2011
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Location: Indiana
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| Posted: 04/07/15 11:32 am ::: |
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| ArtBest23 wrote: |
The officials didn't dictate the outcome of that game.
Duke's guards dictated the outcome of that game. That and Dekker playing like crap.
And Mike Krzyzewski outcoached Bo Ryan. Ryan's stubborn lack of adjustment to take advantage of Okafor and Winslow sitting on the bench in foul trouble for extended periods was inexplicable.
Believe me, I'm no Duke MBB fan. And Wiscy may have been the sentimental favorite. But Duke earned that championship.
Oh, and Ryan's post-game whining and "we don't do a rent-a-player" cracks were really unseemly sour grapes, particularly for a guy who usually exhibits class and sportsmanship. |
There were at least 4 huge calls that all went against Wisconsin in the final 4 - 5 minutes of the game. They most certainly played a large part in the outcome of the game. Again, if they happen in the first half, no big deal but the timing of them were HUGE. It was a tied/very close game when all those calls happened.
Duke's guards played very well, not taking anything away from them at all.
I'm not one to blame officials and never have, but those missed/blown calls were really hard to overcome.
How can the officials actually go to replay and say this is NOT off Duke? Watch his middle finger bend back:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhzXOIC0SRM
At :36 into this video you will see the Duke player step on the end line, then hop a time or 2 before passing the ball to Okafor, who scores & draws a foul on Kaminsky. At :52 seconds they will show the close up:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NumhLOe-4io
Trying to find the footage of a couple of the no-calls on charges as well as the terrible blocking call.
Regardless, all those calls went Duke's way and definitely played a role in the outcome.
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 04/07/15 11:36 am ::: |
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| purduefanatic wrote: |
| ArtBest23 wrote: |
The officials didn't dictate the outcome of that game.
Duke's guards dictated the outcome of that game. That and Dekker playing like crap.
And Mike Krzyzewski outcoached Bo Ryan. Ryan's stubborn lack of adjustment to take advantage of Okafor and Winslow sitting on the bench in foul trouble for extended periods was inexplicable.
Believe me, I'm no Duke MBB fan. And Wiscy may have been the sentimental favorite. But Duke earned that championship.
Oh, and Ryan's post-game whining and "we don't do a rent-a-player" cracks were really unseemly sour grapes, particularly for a guy who usually exhibits class and sportsmanship. |
There were at least 4 huge calls that all went against Wisconsin in the final 4 - 5 minutes of the game. They most certainly played a large part in the outcome of the game. Again, if they happen in the first half, no big deal but the timing of them were HUGE. It was a tied/very close game when all those calls happened.
Duke's guards played very well, not taking anything away from them at all.
I'm not one to blame officials and never have, but those missed/blown calls were really hard to overcome.
How can the officials actually go to replay and say this is NOT off Duke? Watch his middle finger bend back:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhzXOIC0SRM
At :36 into this video you will see the Duke player step on the end line, then hop a time or 2 before passing the ball to Okafor, who scores & draws a foul on Kaminsky. At :52 seconds they will show the close up:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NumhLOe-4io
Trying to find the footage of a couple of the no-calls on charges as well as the terrible blocking call.
Regardless, all those calls went Duke's way and definitely played a role in the outcome. |
They showed that out of bounds replay ad nauseum from many angles. I tend to agree it propably nicked his finger but it certainly wasn't obvious and they ruled - probably correctly - that it wasn't sufficient to overturn the live call.
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GlennMacGrady
Joined: 03 Jan 2005
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| Posted: 04/07/15 11:39 am ::: |
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| ArtBest23 wrote: |
Per Twitter:
"Duke-Wisconsin on CBS banks a 17.1 rating/27 share, the highest figures since Arizona-Kentucky in 1997"
Guess MCBB must be doing something right. |
From that datum, it's perhaps more accurate to say that MCBB has done something right once in the last 18 years.
What was "right" was that there were competitive, exciting games and a sort of Cinderella/Snow White team in Wisconsin. Those things are more important than higher scoring in the abstract. No joke. |
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purduefanatic
Joined: 10 Aug 2011
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Location: Indiana
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| Posted: 04/07/15 11:45 am ::: |
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| ArtBest23 wrote: |
| They showed that out of bounds replay ad nauseum from many angles. I tend to agree it propably nicked his finger but it certainly wasn't obvious and they ruled - probably correctly - that it wasn't sufficient to overturn the live call. |
Oh please. Everyone with any common sense can see that it hit his finger and you can even see it bend backwards. There is no way his finger does that unless it has been hit by something, which in this case was the basketball. The officials blew it, plain and simple.
And the missed stepping on the baseline? I suppose that was too close for the ref to actually make a call as well?
When you add 4 or 5 calls together in the span of 3 minutes of the final 5 minutes of the game, it most certainly has an affect on the outcome, especially when they lead to points for the team benefiting from the bad calls.
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ArtBest23
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purduefanatic
Joined: 10 Aug 2011
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| Posted: 04/07/15 11:58 am ::: |
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Ah, the classic redirect...gotcha.
There were lots of issues in that game as well.
But alas, we were talking about the National Championship game.
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 04/07/15 12:06 pm ::: |
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| purduefanatic wrote: |
Ah, the classic redirect...gotcha.
There were lots of issues in that game as well.
But alas, we were talking about the National Championship game. |
Yeah, you were blaming it all on the refs. I remember.
Wisconsin probably wouldn't even have been there without much worse officiating in the Ky game.
I don't understand the modern trend that no one can just enjoy and accept a great basketball game without endless whining about officials.
The officials did not determine the outcome. Duke won the game. Deal with it.
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beknighted
Joined: 11 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 04/07/15 12:51 pm ::: |
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| purduefanatic wrote: |
And the missed stepping on the baseline? I suppose that was too close for the ref to actually make a call as well?
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The baseline call (or, really, non-call) was obviously wrong, but my first thought when I saw the replay was whether anyone who wasn't looking at it from right above (where the camera was) would have seen it. I know refs are supposed to be looking at the ball and the players' feet, etc. when someone is in that area, but in reality you can't look at everything at once.
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purduefanatic
Joined: 10 Aug 2011
Posts: 2819
Location: Indiana
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| Posted: 04/07/15 1:05 pm ::: |
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| ArtBest23 wrote: |
| purduefanatic wrote: |
Ah, the classic redirect...gotcha.
There were lots of issues in that game as well.
But alas, we were talking about the National Championship game. |
Yeah, you were blaming it all on the refs. I remember.
Wisconsin probably wouldn't even have been there without much worse officiating in the Ky game.
I don't understand the modern trend that no one can just enjoy and accept a great basketball game without endless whining about officials.
The officials did not determine the outcome. Duke won the game. Deal with it. |
Blaming it all on the officials? That is very laughable as I didn't say that. What I did say was that those calls were huge in the outcome of the game.
I enjoyed the game quite a bit up until those few minutes. But thanks for your input and I'm sorry you just don't understand.
You're an ass. Unfortunately, we're all dealing with that.
Last edited by purduefanatic on 04/07/15 1:10 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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purduefanatic
Joined: 10 Aug 2011
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Location: Indiana
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| Posted: 04/07/15 1:08 pm ::: |
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| beknighted wrote: |
| purduefanatic wrote: |
And the missed stepping on the baseline? I suppose that was too close for the ref to actually make a call as well?
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The baseline call (or, really, non-call) was obviously wrong, but my first thought when I saw the replay was whether anyone who wasn't looking at it from right above (where the camera was) would have seen it. I know refs are supposed to be looking at the ball and the players' feet, etc. when someone is in that area, but in reality you can't look at everything at once. |
When you watch the replay, there was an official on the endline. They are taught that when a player drives along the baseline that they need to take a look at their feet when they get close to it. As Winslow had just gotten there, the ref should have glanced down and he would have seen it.
Again, officials are going to make mistakes. But 3 or 4 in a row like that at that time of the game is a killer.
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 04/07/15 1:10 pm ::: |
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| purduefanatic wrote: |
| ArtBest23 wrote: |
| purduefanatic wrote: |
Ah, the classic redirect...gotcha.
There were lots of issues in that game as well.
But alas, we were talking about the National Championship game. |
Yeah, you were blaming it all on the refs. I remember.
Wisconsin probably wouldn't even have been there without much worse officiating in the Ky game.
I don't understand the modern trend that no one can just enjoy and accept a great basketball game without endless whining about officials.
The officials did not determine the outcome. Duke won the game. Deal with it. |
Blaming it all on the officials? That is very laughable as I didn't say that. What I did say was that those calls were huge in the outcome of the game.
You're an ass. Unfortunately, we're all dealing with that. |
Sure, whatever. It's always everyone else, because you're always perfect. Yeah, everything was "in favor of the coaching God known as Coach K" but you weren't blaming it on the officials. What a joke. I'm done.
| purduefanatic wrote: |
And I know we like to complain about officiating in women's basketball, but that was some extremely poor whistle blowing down the stretch, all in favor of the coaching God known as Coach K.
1. A Duke player's finger clearly bends on replay, thus showing clearly that the ball hit him, yet even after review, the refs stick with the ball going to Duke. Huge call as Duke hit a '3' on that possession.
2. A minute prior to that, a Duke player was driving, stepped on the end line & bounced a couple of times on that foot before passing to Okafor. Okafor converted a layup and also got a foul called on Kaminshy of Wisconsin.
3. A minute or 2 before that, Winslow of Duke just flat out jumps in the air and runs over a Wisconsin defender (a play that is a charge and was called all year long in every game I saw). He passes and it leads to another '3'.
There were at least 2 other calls that were at worst 50/50 calls (leaned more towards Wisky guys) and they went the way of Duke.
Absolutely horrible officiating...and played a huge role in the outcome. I feel bad for Bo Ryan and the Badgers. |
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purduefanatic
Joined: 10 Aug 2011
Posts: 2819
Location: Indiana
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| Posted: 04/07/15 1:12 pm ::: |
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| ArtBest23 wrote: |
| I'm done. |
God, if only this were true.
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GlennMacGrady
Joined: 03 Jan 2005
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| Posted: 04/10/15 12:18 am ::: |
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K on G:
<iframe width="640" height="360" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/YZsVYlASaiI?feature=player_detailpage" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe> |
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