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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006 Posts: 64255
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Stonington_QB
Joined: 05 Jul 2013 Posts: 764 Location: Siege Perilous
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 67491 Location: Where the action is
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Posted: 06/29/22 3:54 pm ::: |
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There's a big difference between the media saying someone is willing to testify and actually testifying under oath
_________________ The truth is like poetry
Most people hate poetry
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Stonington_QB
Joined: 05 Jul 2013 Posts: 764 Location: Siege Perilous
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Posted: 06/29/22 6:25 pm ::: |
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pilight wrote: |
There's a big difference between the media saying someone is willing to testify and actually testifying under oath |
So the SS agent is willing to testify, but if this committee chooses not to ask him, we should just accept a secondhand account of the events that evidently may not have taken place?
Solid argument.
I have to wonder at this point if anyone is even remotely interested in the truth, or if it's really just about getting Trump.
If her testimony falls apart you can kiss this TV drama goodbye.
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009 Posts: 15838 Location: OREGON (in my heart)
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Ex-Ref
Joined: 04 Oct 2009 Posts: 9274
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Posted: 06/29/22 10:13 pm ::: |
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Why would she lie? What would that gain her? To be in the position that she was at 25, she's smart enough to know that lying to congress is not going to be favorable to her.
_________________ "Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 67491 Location: Where the action is
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Posted: 06/29/22 10:18 pm ::: |
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This is even more of a show trial than Griner's will be
_________________ The truth is like poetry
Most people hate poetry
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009 Posts: 15838 Location: OREGON (in my heart)
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Posted: 06/30/22 12:28 am ::: |
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pilight wrote: |
This is even more of a show trial than Griner's will be |
Ahhh, but THIS isn't a trial, 'show' or otherwise. This is a congressional investigation, a fact-finding mission. Of course, if there is ANY possibility of 'other' truth to be told, you'd think the characters like Mike Flynn, etc., might just talk, instead of pleading the 5th. Or even show up, like Meadows isn't.
_________________ Oregon: Go Ducks!
"Inévitablement, les canards voleront"
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 67491 Location: Where the action is
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Posted: 06/30/22 7:49 am ::: |
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True enough. In a legitimate trial all that hearsay would be inadmissible and invocation of the 5th amendment wouldn't be treated as an admission of guilt. It's just a show.
_________________ The truth is like poetry
Most people hate poetry
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 67491 Location: Where the action is
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Posted: 07/01/22 7:03 pm ::: |
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https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/01/politics/secret-service-lunging-incident/index.html
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The sources tell CNN that stories circulated about the incident – including details that are similar to how former White House aide Cassidy Hutchinson described it to the House select committee investigating January 6 – in the months immediately afterward the US Capitol attack and before she testified this week. |
_________________ The truth is like poetry
Most people hate poetry
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scullyfu
Joined: 01 Jan 2006 Posts: 8888 Location: Niagara Falls
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FrozenLVFan
Joined: 08 Jul 2014 Posts: 3521
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Posted: 07/02/22 4:13 pm ::: |
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pilight wrote: |
https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/01/politics/secret-service-lunging-incident/index.html
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The sources tell CNN that stories circulated about the incident – including details that are similar to how former White House aide Cassidy Hutchinson described it to the House select committee investigating January 6 – in the months immediately afterward the US Capitol attack and before she testified this week. |
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While everyone seems to agree that Trump did a lot of yelling and cursing, most of the stuff in that CNN article contradicts Hutchinson's statements about the SUV incident. It's also second or third hand, so who knows.
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"He had sort of lunged forward -- it was unclear from the conversations I had that he actually made physical contact, but he might have. I don't know," the source said. "Nobody said Trump assaulted him; they said he tried to lunge over the seat -- for what reason, nobody had any idea."
The employee said he'd heard about the incident multiple times as far back as February 2021 from other agents, including some who were part of the presidential protective detail during that time period but none of whom were involved in the incident. |
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The other Secret Service source, who spoke to the driver and another agent who wasn't there, said he heard about Trump verbally lashing out at his detail but not about any physical altercation. Neither source told CNN they had heard about Trump trying to grab at the steering wheel. |
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A separate Secret Service official previously told CNN that Engel denied that Trump grabbed at the steering wheel or lunged toward an agent on his detail, and that Ornato denied telling Hutchinson the same. The official did not dispute that Trump directed his agents to take him to the Capitol. |
Lord, those SS agents are a gossipy bunch. Sounds like a game of post office.
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Ex-Ref
Joined: 04 Oct 2009 Posts: 9274
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Posted: 07/03/22 9:29 am ::: |
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FrozenLVFan wrote: |
Lord, those SS agents are a gossipy bunch. Sounds like a game of post office. |
And possibly not always truthful.
From a subscriber article:
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Troye, the Homeland Security and Counterterrorism advisor to then-Vice President Mike Pence, told USA TODAY Saturday that Ornato has a history of changing his story when it becomes politically troublesome for Trump. |
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"There seems to be a pattern here of conversations that happen that are inconvenient conversations for Tony and then he comes back and says that they never happened," Troye said. "That really speaks to Tony's character and credibility, and whether he has a history of doing [Trump's] bidding, and then denying it to protect him." |
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Soon after, Farah Griffin, a former Trump White House communications director, weighed in with her own tweet. "Tony Ornato lied about me too. During the protests at Lafayette sq in 2020, I told Mark Meadows & Ornato they needed to warn press staged there before clearing the square," she said. "Meadows replied: “we aren’t doing that.” Tony later lied &said the exchange never happened. He knows it did." |
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On Saturday, Leonnig also questioned Ornato's truthfulness when it comes to incidents involving Trump. She said on MSNBC's "Morning Joe" that Ornato lied to her and other reporters about the incident at Lafayette Square, saying Trump aides did not clear the crowded park so he could walk to a nearby church and do a photo op with a Bible in his hand.
“That's not true. He was at the center of that,” said Leonnig, who also wrote the best-selling 2022 book, “Zero Fail: The Rise and Fall of the Secret Service.” |
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Leonnig said Saturday of Ornato, “Trump White House staffers and Secret Service agents have told me repeatedly he's a Trump acolyte. He will defend the president to the end, and he remains in contact with Trump world.”
"So I want to stress that also, Tony Ornato has indicated to his bosses that this story Cassidy Hutchinson told didn't happen. Well, Tony Ornato has said a lot of things didn't happen," said Leonnig. |
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2022/07/03/two-former-white-house-aides-say-top-secret-service-official-may-lying-protect-trump/7796127001/
_________________ "Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw
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Ex-Ref
Joined: 04 Oct 2009 Posts: 9274
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Posted: 07/10/22 3:41 pm ::: |
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A lawyer for former Trump strategist Steve Bannon, who faces criminal charges after months of defying a congressional subpoena, told the committee over the weekend that Bannon may now be willing to testify, according to committee members.
The committee has said there is evidence that Bannon “had specific knowledge about the events planned for Jan. 6 before they occurred.” It cited as an example comments that he made on his podcast the day before the riot.
“It’s not going to happen like you think it’s going to happen. OK, it’s going to be quite extraordinarily different. All I can say is strap in,” Bannon said in that podcast. “All hell is going to break loose tomorrow. … So many people said, ‘Man, if I was in a revolution, I would be in Washington.’ Well, this is your time in history.” |
https://www.wishtv.com/news/national/jan-6-panel-sets-prime-time-hearing-on-trump-awaits-bannon/
_________________ "Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009 Posts: 15838 Location: OREGON (in my heart)
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Posted: 07/22/22 12:24 pm ::: |
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Ex-Ref wrote: |
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A lawyer for former Trump strategist Steve Bannon, who faces criminal charges after months of defying a congressional subpoena, told the committee over the weekend that Bannon may now be willing to testify, according to committee members.
The committee has said there is evidence that Bannon “had specific knowledge about the events planned for Jan. 6 before they occurred.” It cited as an example comments that he made on his podcast the day before the riot.
“It’s not going to happen like you think it’s going to happen. OK, it’s going to be quite extraordinarily different. All I can say is strap in,” Bannon said in that podcast. “All hell is going to break loose tomorrow. … So many people said, ‘Man, if I was in a revolution, I would be in Washington.’ Well, this is your time in history.” |
https://www.wishtv.com/news/national/jan-6-panel-sets-prime-time-hearing-on-trump-awaits-bannon/ |
Ex, I think you should spearhead whatever forces you can muster to OUST your US Rep, Jim Banks. He's actually quoted on Fox as saying these latest hearings actually exonerate Trump!! He really runs 'under the radar' as one of the more sycophantic idiots in Trumpland, demonstrating more oral hemorrhoids than one can imagine. You have my sympathy.
Re: last night's hearings, anybody have any fave parts? I loved Josh Hawley prancing in the congressional hallways during the insurrection to hide his skanky azz.
_________________ Oregon: Go Ducks!
"Inévitablement, les canards voleront"
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Ex-Ref
Joined: 04 Oct 2009 Posts: 9274
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Posted: 07/22/22 7:48 pm ::: |
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Quote: |
Re: last night's hearings, anybody have any fave parts? I loved Josh Hawley prancing in the congressional hallways during the insurrection to hide his skanky azz. |
I think that Josh Hawley running was everyone's favorite moment! Lots of people have put the moment to music. Too funny!
https://twitter.com/The_Mal_Gallery/status/1550289866411634689
One of my favorite moments came at the end when Liz Chaney called out Bill Barr and all of the other chicken shit's that won't appear.
Much thanks to NPR for the transcription. https://www.npr.org/2022/07/22/1112138665/jan-6-committee-hearing-transcript
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LIZ CHENEY: And let me again thank our witnesses today. We've seen bravery and honor in these hearings. And Ms. Matthews and Mr. Pottinger, both of you will be remembered for that. As will Cassidy Hutchinson. She sat here alone took the oath and testified before millions of Americans. She knew all along that she would be attacked by President Trump and by the 50, 60, and 70 year old men who hide themselves behind executive privilege.
But like our witnesses today, she has courage and she did it anyway. Cassidy, Sara, and our other witnesses including Officer Caroline Edwards, Shaye Moss and her mother, Ruby Freeman, are an inspiration to American women and to American girls. We owe a debt to all of those who have and will appear here.
And that brings me to another point. This committee has shown you the testimony of dozens of Republican witnesses, those who served President Trump loyally for years. The case against Donald Trump in these hearings is not made by witnesses who were his political enemies, it is instead a series of confessions by Donald Trump's own appointees, his own friends, his own campaign officials, people who worked for him for years, and his own family.
They have come forward and they have told the American people the truth. And for those of you who seemed to think the evidence would be different if Republican Leader McCarthy had not withdrawn his nominees from this committee, let me ask you this, do you really think Bill Barr is such a delicate flower that he would wilt under cross- examination?
Pat Cipollone, Eric Herscmann, Jeff Rosen, Richard Donoghue? Of course they aren't. None of our witnesses are. At one point in 2016 when he was first running for office Donald Trump said this, I could stand in the middle of Fifth Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn't lose any voters. That quote came to mind last week when audio from Trump advisor, Steve Bannon, surfaced from October 31st, 2020, just a few days before the Presidential election. |
_________________ "Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw
Last edited by Ex-Ref on 07/22/22 8:02 pm; edited 3 times in total |
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Ex-Ref
Joined: 04 Oct 2009 Posts: 9274
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Posted: 07/22/22 7:53 pm ::: |
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Howee wrote: |
Ex-Ref wrote: |
Quote: |
A lawyer for former Trump strategist Steve Bannon, who faces criminal charges after months of defying a congressional subpoena, told the committee over the weekend that Bannon may now be willing to testify, according to committee members.
The committee has said there is evidence that Bannon “had specific knowledge about the events planned for Jan. 6 before they occurred.” It cited as an example comments that he made on his podcast the day before the riot.
“It’s not going to happen like you think it’s going to happen. OK, it’s going to be quite extraordinarily different. All I can say is strap in,” Bannon said in that podcast. “All hell is going to break loose tomorrow. … So many people said, ‘Man, if I was in a revolution, I would be in Washington.’ Well, this is your time in history.” |
https://www.wishtv.com/news/national/jan-6-panel-sets-prime-time-hearing-on-trump-awaits-bannon/ |
Ex, I think you should spearhead whatever forces you can muster to OUST your US Rep, Jim Banks. He's actually quoted on Fox as saying these latest hearings actually exonerate Trump!! He really runs 'under the radar' as one of the more sycophantic idiots in Trumpland, demonstrating more oral hemorrhoids than one can imagine. You have my sympathy.
Re: last night's hearings, anybody have any fave parts? I loved Josh Hawley prancing in the congressional hallways during the insurrection to hide his skanky azz. |
Thank you for the sympathy. Unfortunately I think that it runs in the family tree. I know a couple of his cousins. One got caught telling a lie about me. Tried to pass the blame to me when it was ALL her fault. It could have been her word against mine. Lucky for me that my manager at the time (we barely tolerated each other) knew that I wouldn't have told the cousin what she said that I had told her.
It all made sense when I found out who her cousin is.
_________________ "Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw
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threadkiller1201
Joined: 19 Sep 2005 Posts: 455
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Posted: 07/24/22 1:11 pm ::: |
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Ex-Ref wrote: |
Quote: |
Re: last night's hearings, anybody have any fave parts? I loved Josh Hawley prancing in the congressional hallways during the insurrection to hide his skanky azz. |
I think that Josh Hawley running was everyone's favorite moment! Lots of people have put the moment to music. Too funny!
https://twitter.com/The_Mal_Gallery/status/1550289866411634689
One of my favorite moments came at the end when Liz Chaney called out Bill Barr and all of the other chicken shit's that won't appear.
Much thanks to NPR for the transcription. https://www.npr.org/2022/07/22/1112138665/jan-6-committee-hearing-transcript
Quote: |
LIZ CHENEY: And let me again thank our witnesses today. We've seen bravery and honor in these hearings. And Ms. Matthews and Mr. Pottinger, both of you will be remembered for that. As will Cassidy Hutchinson. She sat here alone took the oath and testified before millions of Americans. She knew all along that she would be attacked by President Trump and by the 50, 60, and 70 year old men who hide themselves behind executive privilege.
But like our witnesses today, she has courage and she did it anyway. Cassidy, Sara, and our other witnesses including Officer Caroline Edwards, Shaye Moss and her mother, Ruby Freeman, are an inspiration to American women and to American girls. We owe a debt to all of those who have and will appear here.
And that brings me to another point. This committee has shown you the testimony of dozens of Republican witnesses, those who served President Trump loyally for years. The case against Donald Trump in these hearings is not made by witnesses who were his political enemies, it is instead a series of confessions by Donald Trump's own appointees, his own friends, his own campaign officials, people who worked for him for years, and his own family.
They have come forward and they have told the American people the truth. And for those of you who seemed to think the evidence would be different if Republican Leader McCarthy had not withdrawn his nominees from this committee, let me ask you this, do you really think Bill Barr is such a delicate flower that he would wilt under cross- examination?
Pat Cipollone, Eric Herscmann, Jeff Rosen, Richard Donoghue? Of course they aren't. None of our witnesses are. At one point in 2016 when he was first running for office Donald Trump said this, I could stand in the middle of Fifth Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn't lose any voters. That quote came to mind last week when audio from Trump advisor, Steve Bannon, surfaced from October 31st, 2020, just a few days before the Presidential election. |
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Wasn't Bill Barr testifying on a lot of videos they showed? I don't think she's talking about him as one that won't testify.
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 67491 Location: Where the action is
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Posted: 08/03/22 3:34 pm ::: |
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Jan. 6 Committee Prepares to Subpoena Alex Jones’ Texts, Emails
https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/alex-jones-cell-phone-jan6-committee-subpoeana-1392270/
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On Wednesday, Sandy Hook victims’ attorney Mark Bankston told Jones that his attorney had mistakenly sent Bankston three years worth of the conspiracy theorist’s emails and text messages copied from his phone.
Now — a source familiar with the matter and another person briefed on it tell Rolling Stone — the January 6th committee is preparing to request that data from the plaintiff attorneys in order to aid its investigation of the insurrection. |
_________________ The truth is like poetry
Most people hate poetry
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GlennMacGrady
Joined: 03 Jan 2005 Posts: 8314 Location: Heisenberg
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Posted: 08/04/22 2:54 pm ::: |
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pilight wrote: |
Jan. 6 Committee Prepares to Subpoena Alex Jones’ Texts, Emails
https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/alex-jones-cell-phone-jan6-committee-subpoeana-1392270/
Quote: |
On Wednesday, Sandy Hook victims’ attorney Mark Bankston told Jones that his attorney had mistakenly sent Bankston three years worth of the conspiracy theorist’s emails and text messages copied from his phone.
Now — a source familiar with the matter and another person briefed on it tell Rolling Stone — the January 6th committee is preparing to request that data from the plaintiff attorneys in order to aid its investigation of the insurrection. |
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I don't follow anything to do with Alex Jones, but if his lawyer did this, he or she should be subject to malpractice. Also, I would think there's a good argument that the emails should be immune from subpoena because they are subject to either the attorney-client privilege or attorney work product privilege, or both, but I'm not sure because I've never heard of anything like it. |
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009 Posts: 15838 Location: OREGON (in my heart)
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Posted: 08/04/22 3:21 pm ::: |
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Isn't that more applicable if the documents shared were regarding the communications between the client and the attorney regarding this trial?
If they're about things pertaining to J6, and weren't communications with an attorney, why couldn't the hearing committee subpoena them?
Regardless, it was refreshing to see that piece of shit get apoplectic when the lead attorney brought it up.
_________________ Oregon: Go Ducks!
"Inévitablement, les canards voleront"
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GlennMacGrady
Joined: 03 Jan 2005 Posts: 8314 Location: Heisenberg
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Posted: 08/04/22 3:55 pm ::: |
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Howee wrote: |
Isn't that more applicable if the documents shared were regarding the communications between the client and the attorney regarding this trial?
If they're about things pertaining to J6, and weren't communications with an attorney, why couldn't the hearing committee subpoena them? |
I don't know what was in the emails, but you're instinct is likely correct that the privilege would be most applicable to things related to the J6 inquiry, or anything else, about which the client was specifically asking the attorney for legal advice.
In the old days before the infernalnet, if a client handed me a bunch of files to get my legal opinion about them, and I then mistakenly mailed them to the opposing attorney in litigation, I believe I'd try to claim some sort of privilege before giving them up to some third party. I'd really have to research the privilege issue, but I have no motivation to do that for legal or political things I'm not really interested in. I commented only because it is such a techno-world curiosity. |
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009 Posts: 15838 Location: OREGON (in my heart)
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Stonington_QB
Joined: 05 Jul 2013 Posts: 764 Location: Siege Perilous
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