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PickledGinger
Joined: 04 Oct 2013
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 Posted: 11/01/22 7:23 pm ::: |
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| ucbart wrote: |
| pilight wrote: |
| Richyyy wrote: |
| I never really expected Brink to declare early. Along with her exceptional basketball skills she basically looks like an instagram model, so I imagine she's making a (relative) fortune from NIL deals. Along with Bueckers she might be one of the first who are making so much in college that it influences not needing to turn pro for the cash. |
It pays to be blonde... |
And there is nothing wrong with that. |
Well, culturally maybe. But she’s not wrong for taking advantage of what’s been given to her.
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WNBA 09
Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 12539
Location: Dallas , Texas
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| Posted: 11/01/22 11:03 pm ::: |
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| Brink comes from a high class lifestyle. You guys forget she’s Steph curry’s god sister . I doubt money would be a factor in turning pro . Degree is the priority and one from Stanford is premier in America . Basketball or not .
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Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019
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DFWub2018
Joined: 24 Aug 2018
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Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019
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| Posted: 11/04/22 2:41 pm ::: |
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| DFWub2018 wrote: |
| Damn, there are only 3 PG's in this entire '23 class😲 |
On true PGs, the list is pretty thin, yes (sorry, Haley Jones) – at least as of now. Still some good scoring guards who can initiate the offense, but it's hard for even the truest of PGs to make it in the W at that position as youngsters.
Although things have never been more volatile with respect to movement up & down the draft board, as well as a host of true seniors who could opt to return to school the next year with the help of the covid bonus year (like some in this group did last year, Ashley Joens being the biggest name). Most of those legit 1st-round talents though won't – I believe Haley Jones has already definitively stated this'll be her last season. We'll likely hear others along the way say so as well.
As for the PG pool: I did have true PGs like Elisa Pinzan (Maryland) and Lauren Park-Lane (Seton Hall) in mind. Pinzan transferred in from South Florida, and I'd say she's a mostly known quantity as a player – though not technically at the Power-5 level, so maybe that really opens up her productivity. Park-Lane is listed at 5-3, which alone could very well scare off any & every GM despite her existing productivity. (Forgive me for leaving Park-Lane off [for now], Queenie. 😓 )
I also thought of specifically Haley Cavinder, especially now that both of the twins are at the Power-5 level (Miami). But they're both signed to WWE, so I took them out of this equation entirely. (Hopefully I did so prematurely, as that would be a pleasant surprise.) Obviously WWE was able to get to them first once NIL deals became legalized, but I get the sense that they might not think of the W as a good fit for them "brand"-wise anyway. 
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GEF34
Joined: 23 Jul 2008
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| Posted: 11/04/22 8:18 pm ::: |
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| I'm curious why no one thinks Charisma Osborne from UCLA isn't on any WNBA coach's radars for the draft. She has proven she can score, defend and play both guard positions for a top program, and even last year she lead a team that probably had no business being on the bubble of the NCAA tournament due to all the injuries to the bubble. I don't think she will be a lottery pick, but I would be shocked if she doesn't hear her name called in April, unless she decides not to enter the draft.
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Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019
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| Posted: 11/04/22 9:17 pm ::: |
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Charisma Osborne has never had a season where she has shot above 40% from the field, which is a big problem when you’re a true SG. Statistically, she does everything else sorta well – and she’s also not a bad defender imo – but she doesn’t do anything super well (other than score at a fairly high volume, but that’s not necessarily a plus if you’re not doing it at least semi-efficiently). And at 5-9, she also doesn’t have that good size that other true off-guards in this draft pool have. That’s not to say she doesn’t have the talent to have a great year, because she absolutely does. But that’s what it’ll take to be drafted high. She could still get drafted late, but that’s why I don’t have her on my list for now. The Pac-12 overall is pretty devoid of draftable talent this year outside of Stanford.
The only reason I have Zia Cooke on my list is because she averages double-digit scoring on the best wcbb team in the country. Of course she’ll get drafted, and she has the talent to play at a consistent level like Osborne does. But like Osborne, she too has had shot-making efficiency issues as an average-sized true SG. Unlike Osborne, it sounds like Cooke will be running the offense more this year – whereas Osborne has had to be a de facto PG off and on the past couple years, which she has said is not her position of choice. Hopefully for her sake UCLA has a more stable PG situation this year. Meanwhile, we’ll see how running the point here & there for South Carolina will affect Cooke’s numbers.
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myrtle
Joined: 02 May 2008
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| Posted: 11/04/22 9:49 pm ::: |
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| between Rice and the grad PG they got who was injured last year, I'm assuming Osborne won't have to play the point much, if any.
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Queenie
Joined: 18 Nov 2004
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Location: Queens
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| Posted: 11/04/22 11:00 pm ::: |
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| Stormeo wrote: |
As for the PG pool: I did have true PGs like Elisa Pinzan (Maryland) and Lauren Park-Lane (Seton Hall) in mind. Pinzan transferred in from South Florida, and I'd say she's a mostly known quantity as a player – though not technically at the Power-5 level, so maybe that really opens up her productivity. Park-Lane is listed at 5-3, which alone could very well scare off any & every GM despite her existing productivity. (Forgive me for leaving Park-Lane off [for now], Queenie. 😓 ) |
Don’t worry about it. I’m well aware of LP being fun-sized, and I almost fell off of more than one chair the year Seton Hall tried to claim she was 5-6. If anyone’s getting drafted out of Seton Hall, it’s Sidney Cooks, especially if she can make that three-point shot just a little more reliable. (Which does nothing to shore up the point guard situation in this draft, I just wanted to mention her.)
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awhom111
Joined: 19 Nov 2014
Posts: 4236
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| Posted: 11/04/22 11:22 pm ::: |
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| Stormeo wrote: |
| DFWub2018 wrote: |
| Damn, there are only 3 PG's in this entire '23 class😲 |
On true PGs, the list is pretty thin, yes (sorry, Haley Jones) – at least as of now. Still some good scoring guards who can initiate the offense, but it's hard for even the truest of PGs to make it in the W at that position as youngsters.
Although things have never been more volatile with respect to movement up & down the draft board, as well as a host of true seniors who could opt to return to school the next year with the help of the covid bonus year (like some in this group did last year, Ashley Joens being the biggest name). Most of those legit 1st-round talents though won't – I believe Haley Jones has already definitively stated this'll be her last season. We'll likely hear others along the way say so as well.
As for the PG pool: I did have true PGs like Elisa Pinzan (Maryland) and Lauren Park-Lane (Seton Hall) in mind. Pinzan transferred in from South Florida, and I'd say she's a mostly known quantity as a player – though not technically at the Power-5 level, so maybe that really opens up her productivity. Park-Lane is listed at 5-3, which alone could very well scare off any & every GM despite her existing productivity. (Forgive me for leaving Park-Lane off [for now], Queenie. 😓 )
I also thought of specifically Haley Cavinder, especially now that both of the twins are at the Power-5 level (Miami). But they're both signed to WWE, so I took them out of this equation entirely. (Hopefully I did so prematurely, as that would be a pleasant surprise.) Obviously WWE was able to get to them first once NIL deals became legalized, but I get the sense that they might not think of the W as a good fit for them "brand"-wise anyway. |
Lexi Gordon signed the same WWE deal and at least attempted a WNBA career.
Now that you have laid out the list like that, I wonder if there is room for Shaneice Swain to play her way up the draft a bit. Of course, last year's draft was notoriously tough on internationals after everyone overdid it the year before. She probably thinks of herself as having the ability to play some point later down the line even if she's not quite there yet. Claudia Contell is another international who is more combo-ish, but is probably looking for a way to downshift to point guard. |
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GEF34
Joined: 23 Jul 2008
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| Posted: 11/05/22 1:51 am ::: |
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| Stormeo wrote: |
Charisma Osborne has never had a season where she has shot above 40% from the field, which is a big problem when you’re a true SG. Statistically, she does everything else sorta well – and she’s also not a bad defender imo – but she doesn’t do anything super well (other than score at a fairly high volume, but that’s not necessarily a plus if you’re not doing it at least semi-efficiently). And at 5-9, she also doesn’t have that good size that other true off-guards in this draft pool have. That’s not to say she doesn’t have the talent to have a great year, because she absolutely does. But that’s what it’ll take to be drafted high. She could still get drafted late, but that’s why I don’t have her on my list for now. The Pac-12 overall is pretty devoid of draftable talent this year outside of Stanford.
The only reason I have Zia Cooke on my list is because she averages double-digit scoring on the best wcbb team in the country. Of course she’ll get drafted, and she has the talent to play at a consistent level like Osborne does. But like Osborne, she too has had shot-making efficiency issues as an average-sized true SG. Unlike Osborne, it sounds like Cooke will be running the offense more this year – whereas Osborne has had to be a de facto PG off and on the past couple years, which she has said is not her position of choice. Hopefully for her sake UCLA has a more stable PG situation this year. Meanwhile, we’ll see how running the point here & there for South Carolina will affect Cooke’s numbers. |
That's a fair assessment, but I look at it as she won't be playing the same role on a WNBA team, and a lot of her shots that she takes end up being tougher shots because of her role. Often times she has the ball in her hands at the end of the clock or being double teamed and she still scores at a decent percentage. As myrtle mentions and you allude to if she can be off the ball more and not have to do as much ball handling, it will be interesting to see how it affects her performance on the offensive and defensive end of the court.
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Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019
Posts: 4701
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| Posted: 11/05/22 3:08 am ::: |
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| Queenie wrote: |
| Don’t worry about it. I’m well aware of LP being fun-sized, and I almost fell off of more than one chair the year Seton Hall tried to claim she was 5-6. If anyone’s getting drafted out of Seton Hall, it’s Sidney Cooks, especially if she can make that three-point shot just a little more reliable. (Which does nothing to shore up the point guard situation in this draft, I just wanted to mention her.) |
I know it's been a hot minute since they were in the W and the landscape has totally changed; but if Temeka Johnson, Shannon Bobbitt, and *looks at notes* Debbie Black could make it, why not Lauren Park-Lane? Tiny players are used to being tiny their whole lives, I suspect. How intimidated would the best tiny players really be going from college to the pros? which can be half the battle, especially for PGs. And she seems to have a pretty good 3PT shot if last year's improvement is any indication, which is key. I'd love to see if she continues to improve her efficiency.
Cooks does look like she's finally found the right fit for her in Seton Hall. Breakout campaign last season. If she were to raise just about every stat of hers juuuust a little – PPG, 3PT%, RPG, ATO – she would definitely pick up some extra attention from the pro scouts. Is she very athletic? I haven't seen much of her. I do know she was highly rated out of high school, which certainly doesn't hurt the cause. Neither does playing in the same conference as Siegrist, Morrow, and UConn – the whole-ass school.
| awhom111 wrote: |
Lexi Gordon signed the same WWE deal and at least attempted a WNBA career.
Now that you have laid out the list like that, I wonder if there is room for Shaneice Swain to play her way up the draft a bit. Of course, last year's draft was notoriously tough on internationals after everyone overdid it the year before. She probably thinks of herself as having the ability to play some point later down the line even if she's not quite there yet. Claudia Contell is another international who is more combo-ish, but is probably looking for a way to downshift to point guard. |
Great point about Gordon, thanks for pointing it out. Forgot she was a part of that whole thing. So the Cavinders might even expect to get drafted, let alone care about it. The idea of either of their names being called on Draft Night and them publicly acknowledging it in an unapologetically joyful way is a visual I still have trouble synthesizing in my mind...
Can't wait for the 2023 International Names To Know to be released by, uhh, well I think by womensbasketball247, but did the url/web address/name of the whole thing get changed and I missed it?
| GEF34 wrote: |
| That's a fair assessment, but I look at it as she won't be playing the same role on a WNBA team, and a lot of her shots that she takes end up being tougher shots because of her role. Often times she has the ball in her hands at the end of the clock or being double teamed and she still scores at a decent percentage. As myrtle mentions and you allude to if she can be off the ball more and not have to do as much ball handling, it will be interesting to see how it affects her performance on the offensive and defensive end of the court. |
The good news is, if she still continues to struggle/not be totally comfortable this season, she can come back for another season – at UCLA or elsewhere. If she has that elite season she's capable of though and starts getting projected anywhere near the 1st round, she ought to just turn pro. No need to risk the regression at that point. If Kiki Rice really is All That, amongst any of the other star freshmen, it'll indeed be interesting to see if Osborne's role completely changes into one she's never had while on the team – something more lowkey/x-factorish. Lower-usage efficiency could be a really good look for her...
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awhom111
Joined: 19 Nov 2014
Posts: 4236
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| Posted: 11/05/22 11:33 am ::: |
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| Stormeo wrote: |
| awhom111 wrote: |
Lexi Gordon signed the same WWE deal and at least attempted a WNBA career.
Now that you have laid out the list like that, I wonder if there is room for Shaneice Swain to play her way up the draft a bit. Of course, last year's draft was notoriously tough on internationals after everyone overdid it the year before. She probably thinks of herself as having the ability to play some point later down the line even if she's not quite there yet. Claudia Contell is another international who is more combo-ish, but is probably looking for a way to downshift to point guard. |
Great point about Gordon, thanks for pointing it out. Forgot she was a part of that whole thing. So the Cavinders might even expect to get drafted, let alone care about it. The idea of either of their names being called on Draft Night and them publicly acknowledging it in an unapologetically joyful way is a visual I still have trouble synthesizing in my mind...
Can't wait for the 2023 International Names To Know to be released by, uhh, well I think by womensbasketball247, but did the url/web address/name of the whole thing get changed and I missed it?
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I moved sites and the new link for my work is in my signature. I think Mo might be shutting down womensbasketball247.com but that's up to her. |
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Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019
Posts: 4701
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| Posted: 11/05/22 11:44 am ::: |
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| awhom111 wrote: |
| I moved sites and the new link for my work is in my signature. I think Mo might be shutting down womensbasketball247.com but that's up to her. |
Thank you! Sorry I missed it if you announced the site change previously.
As once stated in the womensbasketball247 slogan: There is no offseason; and that certainly applies to those of y'all who run these websites all days out of the year. Many thanks for past, present, and (hopefully still many) future years. 🥂
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DFWub2018
Joined: 24 Aug 2018
Posts: 1047
Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth
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| Posted: 11/05/22 9:14 pm ::: |
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| Stormeo wrote: |
| DFWub2018 wrote: |
| Damn, there are only 3 PG's in this entire '23 class😲 |
On true PGs, the list is pretty thin, yes (sorry, Haley Jones) – at least as of now. Still some good scoring guards who can initiate the offense, but it's hard for even the truest of PGs to make it in the W at that position as youngsters.
Although things have never been more volatile with respect to movement up & down the draft board, as well as a host of true seniors who could opt to return to school the next year with the help of the covid bonus year (like some in this group did last year, Ashley Joens being the biggest name). Most of those legit 1st-round talents though won't – I believe Haley Jones has already definitively stated this'll be her last season. We'll likely hear others along the way say so as well.
As for the PG pool: I did have true PGs like Elisa Pinzan (Maryland) and Lauren Park-Lane (Seton Hall) in mind. Pinzan transferred in from South Florida, and I'd say she's a mostly known quantity as a player – though not technically at the Power-5 level, so maybe that really opens up her productivity. Park-Lane is listed at 5-3, which alone could very well scare off any & every GM despite her existing productivity. (Forgive me for leaving Park-Lane off [for now], Queenie. 😓 )
I also thought of specifically Haley Cavinder, especially now that both of the twins are at the Power-5 level (Miami). But they're both signed to WWE, so I took them out of this equation entirely. (Hopefully I did so prematurely, as that would be a pleasant surprise.) Obviously WWE was able to get to them first once NIL deals became legalized, but I get the sense that they might not think of the W as a good fit for them "brand"-wise anyway. |
I would like to see Dyaisha Fair in a Wings uniform, not sure who else would be a good fit at #11....any thoughts???
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Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019
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| Posted: 11/05/22 9:57 pm ::: |
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| DFWub2018 wrote: |
| I would like to see Dyaisha Fair in a Wings uniform, not sure who else would be a good fit at #11....any thoughts??? |
Trade up or trade it away is my first/main thought.
Otherwise, as it stands now, a shooter on the wing might be the clearest need. Between players like Sheldon, Robertson, Mikesell, Jump, Frank, Scalia, Meyers, a couple of them probably rise up to become fringe-1st-round candidates by then…
But needs can always change at this time of year.
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DFWub2018
Joined: 24 Aug 2018
Posts: 1047
Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth
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| Posted: 11/06/22 1:01 pm ::: |
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| Stormeo wrote: |
| DFWub2018 wrote: |
| I would like to see Dyaisha Fair in a Wings uniform, not sure who else would be a good fit at #11....any thoughts??? |
Trade up or trade it away is my first/main thought.
Otherwise, as it stands now, a shooter on the wing might be the clearest need. Between players like Sheldon, Robertson, Mikesell, Jump, Frank, Scalia, Meyers, a couple of them probably rise up to become fringe-1st-round candidates by then…
But needs can always change at this time of year. |
What about going after: Courtney Williams, Erica Wheeler or Kristi Toliver on a vet minimum?
Who are you replacing on the Wing spot?
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sigur3
Joined: 18 Jun 2013
Posts: 6191
Location: Chicago-ish
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| Posted: 11/08/22 2:49 pm ::: |
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| Queenie wrote: |
| Stormeo wrote: |
As for the PG pool: I did have true PGs like Elisa Pinzan (Maryland) and Lauren Park-Lane (Seton Hall) in mind. Pinzan transferred in from South Florida, and I'd say she's a mostly known quantity as a player – though not technically at the Power-5 level, so maybe that really opens up her productivity. Park-Lane is listed at 5-3, which alone could very well scare off any & every GM despite her existing productivity. (Forgive me for leaving Park-Lane off [for now], Queenie. 😓 ) |
Don’t worry about it. I’m well aware of LP being fun-sized, and I almost fell off of more than one chair the year Seton Hall tried to claim she was 5-6. If anyone’s getting drafted out of Seton Hall, it’s Sidney Cooks, especially if she can make that three-point shot just a little more reliable. (Which does nothing to shore up the point guard situation in this draft, I just wanted to mention her.) |
Hey, nice avatar!
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LibFan25
Joined: 01 Sep 2012
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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| Posted: 11/10/22 11:37 am ::: |
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| Of course I would be very excited to get Haley Jones in Atlanta
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WNBA 09
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SPD
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singinerd54
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Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005
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| Posted: 11/13/22 9:38 pm ::: |
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Open question: What is Haley Jones at the pro level? Or if you want to get specific, what would she be for the Lynx? Could she be a genuine oversized point guard (at least offensively)? Or are we talking a wing/combo-forward who's a really good passer and contributes in lots of areas? Because she's not a great shooter, and the list of wings who can't really shoot from outside but are stars or even top-level starters is pretty short. She's also not one of those hyper-athletic types who jumps out of the gym, or a physical bully who overpowers with strength. Smart and skilled can translate as well, but not necessarily as smoothly.
She's a lovely college player, and I totally understand why a lot of people really enjoy watching her play. I'm just trying to envision what she turns into at the next level. |
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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| Posted: 11/13/22 10:01 pm ::: |
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| I see Haley Jones as a Swin Cash type. Pre-knee injury Cash, that is.
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