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CBiebel
Joined: 23 Dec 2004 Posts: 1056 Location: PA
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Posted: 06/08/23 8:05 pm ::: New rules for upcoming season |
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Key ones:
1. Flopping rule. First instance gets a warning. After that, the team (not individual) gets fouls.
2. Removal of the restricted area arc. Now defenders aren't allowed to establish a legal guarding position under the basket.
3. Numbers are allowed from 0-99.
4. Amber lights are allowed on backboards to indicate end of the shot clock.
Point of emphasis will be on bench decorum.
https://www.ncaa.org/news/2023/6/8/media-center-panel-approves-flopping-rule-in-womens-basketball.aspx
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Ex-Ref
Joined: 04 Oct 2009 Posts: 8956
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Posted: 06/08/23 9:34 pm ::: Re: New rules for upcoming season |
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#1 - Good - kind of don't understand why it doesn't count as a personal though. Late in the quarter, with 1 or 2 team fouls, go ahead and flop. What's it gonna hurt? If it's only counting as a team foul, may as well try and get a call. Never mind, just read that it will be called a technical foul. So there is no reason after the first failed attempt to get a call.
#2 - Not sure that I understand this.
Only the NCAA...SMH.
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The panel approved reducing the restricted-area arc from 4 feet in the lane to the area directly underneath the basket. Under this new rule, there will be no need for any additional court markings on the floor. |
How are the refs supposed to know where "directly underneath the basket" is without a line?
#3 - Don't like this one, I'm too old school - knew it was coming
#4 - Whatever
POE - Has this been a problem? Seems like there would have been something, you know, important, to address.
_________________ "Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw
“Thank you for showing the fellas that you've got more balls than them,” Haley said, to cheers from the crowd.
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BD22
Joined: 27 Nov 2016 Posts: 70 Location: East
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Posted: 06/09/23 10:53 am ::: |
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deleted
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Queenie
![](http://i.imgur.com/fCu4PEx.jpg)
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 18037 Location: Queens
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Posted: 06/09/23 4:08 pm ::: |
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It sounds like there's a secondary arc that was previously noted by dashed lines somewhere on the floor, and *that's* what's being removed from the rules. The original arc is still there. I think.
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The panel approved reducing the restricted-area arc from 4 feet in the lane to the area directly underneath the basket. Defenders cannot establish a legal guarding position directly underneath the basket. This rule also eliminates the lower defensive box rule.
Under this new rule, there will be no need for any additional court markings on the floor.
The committee hopes simplifying the rule will bring about a better understanding for officials, coaches, players and fans.
Previously, secondary defenders had to be outside the 4-foot restricted-area arc to draw a charge. The lower defensive box was an imaginary area designated by two tick marks on the end line and the second lane space marks from the free-throw line and distinguished when the restricted-area rule was in effect. |
_________________ Ardent believer in the separation of church and stadium.
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summertime blues
![](http://vis-www.cs.umass.edu/lfw/images/Tamika_Catchings/Tamika_Catchings_0001.jpg)
Joined: 16 Apr 2013 Posts: 7853 Location: Shenandoah Valley
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Posted: 06/09/23 4:57 pm ::: |
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Flopping should be a personal, at least the first one. The second on the same person should be a big old T on that person.
_________________ Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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Ex-Ref
Joined: 04 Oct 2009 Posts: 8956
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Posted: 06/09/23 9:49 pm ::: |
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Queenie wrote: |
It sounds like there's a secondary arc that was previously noted by dashed lines somewhere on the floor, and *that's* what's being removed from the rules. The original arc is still there. I think.
Quote: |
The panel approved reducing the restricted-area arc from 4 feet in the lane to the area directly underneath the basket. Defenders cannot establish a legal guarding position directly underneath the basket. This rule also eliminates the lower defensive box rule.
Under this new rule, there will be no need for any additional court markings on the floor.
The committee hopes simplifying the rule will bring about a better understanding for officials, coaches, players and fans.
Previously, secondary defenders had to be outside the 4-foot restricted-area arc to draw a charge. The lower defensive box was an imaginary area designated by two tick marks on the end line and the second lane space marks from the free-throw line and distinguished when the restricted-area rule was in effect. |
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This rule still confuses me. I'm not sure, but I really do think that they are talking away the arc as we know it and making it the size of the basket (18").
I had to look this up last night, and again tonight. I had no clue what they were talking about. I looked at the court diagram (page 15 of the rule book - not the PDF page) and for the first time noticed two hash marks on the baselines.
So we have the "restricted-area arc" ("charge circle" I've sometimes heard it called) that we are familiar with seeing in the lane. Then we have the imaginary "lower defensive box" that they are talking about being designated by the two hash marks on the baseline (three feet outside of the lane) and the hash marks along the lane that are about four feet from the free throw line. This is shown on page 19 of the rule book (not the PDF page number).
From page 18 of the rule book (not the PDF page number):
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Art. 7. To designate the lower defensive box (Rule 1-8.2), two tick marks shall be placed on each side of the lane. Each tick mark shall be a solid 2-inch wide line that is 12 inches long. Each tick mark shall be measured 3 feet from the outside edge of the lane line to the inside edge of the tick mark li |
So if I'm right (I wouldn't put money one it) this would mean that the women's court might still have the arc on it if the men don't do away with it. Schools would need to have it on the court for the guys.
So confusing!!!
Hope that helps, but like I said, don't bank on it being right and what the NCAA is going to do!!!!! 🤣🤣
_________________ "Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw
“Thank you for showing the fellas that you've got more balls than them,” Haley said, to cheers from the crowd.
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BD22
Joined: 27 Nov 2016 Posts: 70 Location: East
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Posted: 06/10/23 9:12 am ::: |
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^ what ex-ref posted is correct. The arc will be on the court because the men use it, but it is no longer being used in the women's game.
Officials will have to determine if someone tries to take a charge under the basket and if they do, call it a block.
The lower defensive box was in place to allow people to take charges while standing in the charge arc if the ball was caught inside that box (i.e. a post up). That box is no longer in play.
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Ex-Ref
Joined: 04 Oct 2009 Posts: 8956
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Posted: 06/10/23 10:50 am ::: |
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BD22 wrote: |
^ what ex-ref posted is correct. The arc will be on the court because the men use it, but it is no longer being used in the women's game.
Officials will have to determine if someone tries to take a charge under the basket and if they do, call it a block.
The lower defensive box was in place to allow people to take charges while standing in the charge arc if the ball was caught inside that box (i.e. a post up). That box is no longer in play. |
Thanks BD.
But won't this just lead to more of the confusion that they wanted to do away with if the guys don't adopt the same rule?
Fans, announcers, even coaches and players, will see the the men's arc on the floor and not understand why it isn't being used.
Then there will be confusion if there isn't some kind of marking to show the area under the basket that the women will use.
Will they need to have separate sections of that portion of the floor that they swap in and out with the proper markings on them? That seems easier (maybe!) than stripping and repainting the lines all of time.
Like I said, "only the NCAA!"
_________________ "Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw
“Thank you for showing the fellas that you've got more balls than them,” Haley said, to cheers from the crowd.
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Queenie
![](http://i.imgur.com/fCu4PEx.jpg)
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 18037 Location: Queens
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Posted: 06/10/23 10:58 pm ::: |
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just what we need, more subjective judgment calls to yell at the refs about
_________________ Ardent believer in the separation of church and stadium.
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linkster
Joined: 27 Jul 2012 Posts: 5423
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Posted: 07/01/23 8:36 pm ::: |
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summertime blues wrote: |
Flopping should be a personal, at least the first one. The second on the same person should be a big old T on that person. |
More warnings will be given out than if it were a foul. The refs already have a tough time with block/charge.
And "decorum on the bench"? Why is that high on a need list? How about addressing freedom of movement? That was a POI a few years ago but it's only been applied to the ball handler. Away from the ball it's a free for all.
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NYSports56
Joined: 03 Jul 2018 Posts: 1126 Location: New Jersey, USA
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Posted: 07/04/23 12:22 pm ::: |
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Queenie wrote: |
just what we need, more subjective judgment calls to yell at the refs about |
That's exactly what I was thinking. That said, I do like the idea that basketball is trying to get rid of the flopping.
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Howee
![](http://www.feathersite.com/Poultry/Ducks/Pekins/EuroPekinDling.JPEG)
Joined: 27 Nov 2009 Posts: 15749 Location: OREGON (in my heart)
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Posted: 07/05/23 3:30 pm ::: |
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BD22 wrote: |
Officials will have to determine if someone tries to take a charge under the basket and if they do, call it a block. |
This particular rule seems oddly timed, given the P.O.E. on flopping - many, MANY *flops* occur right under the basket, and refs are (were) left to determine if the girl had legal position, placement, etc. I've seen many a flop called as a charge in the area beneath the hoop. Now (in theory) a defensive player could get the PF called for an and-1, AND a Flop called, no?
(....REGARDLESS! As long as everyone gently tosses the ball the the refs at any/all whistles, everything else is kosher. See: April 2, 2023) ![Razz](images/smiles/icon_razz.gif)
_________________ Oregon: Go Ducks!
"Inévitablement, les canards voleront"
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ucbart
Joined: 21 Nov 2004 Posts: 2817 Location: New York
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Posted: 07/06/23 4:36 pm ::: |
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NYSports56 wrote: |
Queenie wrote: |
just what we need, more subjective judgment calls to yell at the refs about |
That's exactly what I was thinking. That said, I do like the idea that basketball is trying to get rid of the flopping. |
This is probably the dumbest thing I've ever heard of. The only way this will work is if the officials call a block almost every time. Almost 99.9999% of the charges called, to me, are defensive fouls. I wish the college game would implement defensive 3 seconds.
As for flopping, thank you. But Nika Muhl is in trouble. As is Aneesa Morrow... LOL!
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huskiemaniac
Joined: 24 Nov 2004 Posts: 1050 Location: NE CT
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Posted: 07/07/23 8:39 am ::: |
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i guess this means the end to Duke's routine of practicing flops during pregame warm-up.
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tfan
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Joined: 31 May 2010 Posts: 9644
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Posted: 07/07/23 6:28 pm ::: |
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No flopping, no offensive charge calls. Bulldozers rejoice.
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Ex-Ref
Joined: 04 Oct 2009 Posts: 8956
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Posted: 11/18/23 2:58 pm ::: |
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Ex-Ref wrote: |
BD22 wrote: |
^ what ex-ref posted is correct. The arc will be on the court because the men use it, but it is no longer being used in the women's game.
Officials will have to determine if someone tries to take a charge under the basket and if they do, call it a block.
The lower defensive box was in place to allow people to take charges while standing in the charge arc if the ball was caught inside that box (i.e. a post up). That box is no longer in play. |
Thanks BD.
But won't this just lead to more of the confusion that they wanted to do away with if the guys don't adopt the same rule?
Fans, announcers, even coaches and players, will see the the men's arc on the floor and not understand why it isn't being used.
Then there will be confusion if there isn't some kind of marking to show the area under the basket that the women will use.
Will they need to have separate sections of that portion of the floor that they swap in and out with the proper markings on them? That seems easier (maybe!) than stripping and repainting the lines all of time.
Like I said, "only the NCAA!" |
So this came up in today's game between ND and Illinois. Near the end of the first half. Everyone in the arena thought it was a block. I saw the ref on the baseline call the charge and wondered, WTH????
Rebecca Lobo contacted the broadcast crew with a reminder of this rule. Along with the mention that it was STILL just as confusing because the arc is still on the floor.
_________________ "Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw
“Thank you for showing the fellas that you've got more balls than them,” Haley said, to cheers from the crowd.
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