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johnjohnW
Joined: 11 Aug 2020 Posts: 1861
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Posted: 06/25/22 8:09 pm ::: |
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Richyyy wrote: |
Michelle89 wrote: |
pilight wrote: |
It's going to be funny when Indiana decides her contract is reasonable and claims her on waivers |
They have the capspace? |
Nope. No one does, without really awkward moves. That's probably why this is happening right after the contract guarantee date, making it far less likely someone she doesn't want to play for would claim her contract. |
Honestly, that's fair. She gave us a huge discount. Least we can do is fascilitate her moving on where she wants to go to. Such a shame how this season turned out. I thought we'd be more competitive even without BG.
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Luuuc #NATC
Joined: 10 Feb 2005 Posts: 21950
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readyAIMfire53
Joined: 20 Nov 2004 Posts: 7404 Location: Durham, NC
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Rock Hard
Joined: 02 Aug 2010 Posts: 5390 Location: Chocolate Paradise
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myrtle
Joined: 02 May 2008 Posts: 32340
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Posted: 06/25/22 8:48 pm ::: |
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I'm kinda neutral on Tina. I didn't like her at all until I found out about giving her salary to charity. But her on court behaviour, while not as egregious as some, still looks pretty me, me, me.
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johnjohnW
Joined: 11 Aug 2020 Posts: 1861
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Luuuc #NATC
Joined: 10 Feb 2005 Posts: 21950
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lynxmania
Joined: 18 Feb 2011 Posts: 10697 Location: Minnesota
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ChicagoAnnie
Joined: 04 Sep 2009 Posts: 9199 Location: St. Paul, MN
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Posted: 06/25/22 11:02 pm ::: |
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re: Tina's exit...
-So many questions... Was this a selfish move?
-Was there drama behind the scenes, or did she see the team was going nowhere?
-Since she took a reduced contact to sign with them, assuming BG was going to be there, and was she tired of making that kind of money, and not winning while putting up decent numbers?
-Can a leader be player that bails on her squads?
-Is she the Russell Westbrook, or James Harden of the league? Talented, but can't stay on any team, and bounces when the going gets rough?
_________________ The meteor cannot come fast enough. Start this thing over.
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Silky Johnson
Joined: 29 Sep 2014 Posts: 3325
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Posted: 06/25/22 11:28 pm ::: |
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Luuuc wrote: |
:lol: It has been non-stop all season.
One definite "addition by subtraction" of this divorce will definitely be having less hate pollution in Mercury threads from now on. |
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_________________ Professional Hater. The Baron of #HateHard
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ChicagoAnnie
Joined: 04 Sep 2009 Posts: 9199 Location: St. Paul, MN
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Posted: 06/25/22 11:55 pm ::: |
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mercfan3 wrote: |
Diana is going to be shut down soon.
Edit: maybe the Diana/Skylar (who have looked fine together lately, and we’re close previously) had something to do with this. |
The writing is on the wall. I hope I'm wrong though.
_________________ The meteor cannot come fast enough. Start this thing over.
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J-Spoon
Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Posts: 6821
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Posted: 06/26/22 12:55 am ::: |
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ChicagoAnnie wrote: |
re: Tina's exit...
-So many questions... Was this a selfish move?
-Was there drama behind the scenes, or did she see the team was going nowhere?
-Since she took a reduced contact to sign with them, assuming BG was going to be there, and was she tired of making that kind of money, and not winning while putting up decent numbers?
-Can a leader be player that bails on her squads?
-Is she the Russell Westbrook, or James Harden of the league? Talented, but can't stay on any team, and bounces when the going gets rough? |
Not saying you, just using your post as a launching point.
these are legit questions as I feel Charles' leaving of teams may be being misconstrued.
Charles started in Conn and was there for a while, won an MVP, and the team had a decent level of success in her tenure. Conn's management fired the coach she liked Mike T and she left for NY (Can't remember if she was traded or signed as a free agent but I don't believe she forced her way out in any under handed fashion, but can't remember).
Charles was in NY for a number of seasons, was cored multiple times and NY had decent regular season success with Prince, Nurse and/or Hartley as the next best player on the team. Charles left NY as a free agent, after her coring status got maxed out and when a new coach came in (Hopkins). I am pretty sure she left as a free agent and it was never completely established if she chose to leave or if the new coach and GM weren't interested in bringing her back. There may have been a trade related to her leaving but again it wasn't a trade demand to the best of my knowledge and it was while she was out of contract I believe.
She signed with Washington, skipped the bubble season along with EDD, played in 21 but EDD missed most if not all of the season with injury. Tina had a strong season, but with EDD, Clark and Cloud all missing the season Washington ended up in the lottery. Charles left this past off season as a free agent. Chose to sign with PX at a major discount, you could say ring hunting, but still leaving a lot of money on the table not a very selfish move IMO letting the team keep their free agents and even bring in Deshields on a better contract, but again like in Washington due to circumstances beyond her control the team she joined didn't do as well as thought. It does look like PX is turning it around and with DT and Diggins-Smith-Smith you would think Charles, Turner and Deshields would be enough to be a playoff squad but
Charles and PX agreed to a contractual divorce. We don't know whose idea it was, PX had to agree to it even if it was Charles idea (which does lead to idea that PX might see the writing on the wall, and might be tanking for a decent draft class in 23, you would think for a vet like Tina on a team friendly contract they could have got something in return if they had really wanted to)
Some of those circumstances might seem hazy but I don't see anything in Tina's behavior that seems under handed or diva-ish.
On the court she has been the best player on many teams she has been on so you would assume she would be the first option on those squads (On her NY team's Charles absolutely should have been taking the most shots and getting the most touches), but DT and SDS seemed to get plenty of shots with Charles as a teammate and Atkins and Hines-Allen were heavily involved in the Mystics offense last season with Charles. I also doubt her Olympic teammates Bird, Stewart and Loyd would want her to come to Seattle if they didn't want her there and are probably thrilled that she is joining the Storm.
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 67015 Location: Where the action is
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Posted: 06/26/22 7:36 am ::: |
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https://www.espn.com/wnba/story/_/id/34148342/phoenix-mercury-former-wnba-mvp-tina-charles-part-18-games
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A source told ESPN that Charles' divorce from the Mercury had been in the making for most of the season. She had been unhappy with her role in the offense, which included a desire for more shots, for some time. Charles expected to be used in a more active role in the wake of center Brittney Griner's absence this season but felt like she wasn't given the opportunity, a source said. |
_________________ I'm a lonely frog
I ain't got a home
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ChiSky54
Joined: 19 Jun 2019 Posts: 672 Location: Chicago
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Posted: 06/26/22 8:00 am ::: |
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Charles regularly made comments about wanting to either be traded, cut or divorced from her contract, a source said. Her divorce Saturday came together in a short amount of a time, a source said.
Before signing with the Mercury, Charles had narrowed her choices to Seattle and Phoenix, a source said, but a disagreement between the sides in how Charles would be used by the Storm led her to choose Phoenix. |
Hmmm...so if Seattle takes her now, has this desired role issue been resolved?
_________________ There is nothing new under the sun.
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johnjohnW
Joined: 11 Aug 2020 Posts: 1861
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Posted: 06/26/22 8:27 am ::: |
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ChiSky54 wrote: |
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Charles regularly made comments about wanting to either be traded, cut or divorced from her contract, a source said. Her divorce Saturday came together in a short amount of a time, a source said.
Before signing with the Mercury, Charles had narrowed her choices to Seattle and Phoenix, a source said, but a disagreement between the sides in how Charles would be used by the Storm led her to choose Phoenix. |
Hmmm...so if Seattle takes her now, has this desired role issue been resolved? |
Likely not, it's just her only hope of a title left.
I was fine when my team was on the receiving end of her ring chasing, so I'm not gonna be too made now that we're being burned by her ring chasing. #hateharddenied
Can Vegas afford her? Lol
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Queenie
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 18043 Location: Queens
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Posted: 06/26/22 8:46 am ::: |
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She had been unhappy with her role in the offense, which included a desire for more shots, for some time. |
She’s taking the seventh most shots in the league and the second most on her own team- more than DeShields, more than Taurasi- and she wants more shots. And she wants to go to the team that has two of the only six players in the league who do take more shots than she does? Just get a damn booster if you want more shots.
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Charles expected to be used in a more active role in the wake of center Brittney Griner's absence this season but felt like she wasn't given the opportunity, a source said. |
The player who has practically developed an allergy to the paint and has a crippling addiction to taking 17-foot jumpers from 18 feet thought she was going to take the role of one of the best in-the-paint post players in the league? I’m sorry, what.
I cannot believe that I am in agreement with Sophie Cunningham, of all the fucking assholes, on this, but fuck Tina Charles.
_________________ Ardent believer in the separation of church and stadium.
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Silky Johnson
Joined: 29 Sep 2014 Posts: 3325
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Posted: 06/26/22 10:23 am ::: |
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johnjohnW wrote: |
Likely not, it's just her only hope of a title left.
I was fine when my team was on the receiving end of her ring chasing, so I'm not gonna be too made now that we're being burned by her ring chasing. #hateharddenied
Can Vegas afford her? Lol |
Y'all go ahead and keep accusing her of "ring chasing," if you want to, but what was the alternative? It's not like there's a borderline playoff team that's a Tina Charles-shaped piece away from being a contender; you think that if she'd signed with the Dream, instead, they'd be any closer to a title? Because I don't. So what was she supposed to do? Take the rest of the year off? Retire? Sign with the Fever to prove some kind of point?
_________________ Professional Hater. The Baron of #HateHard
My team no longer exists, so I'll have to settle for hating yours.
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myrtle
Joined: 02 May 2008 Posts: 32340
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Posted: 06/26/22 11:10 am ::: |
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Silky Johnson wrote: |
Sign with the Fever to prove some kind of point? |
Hey, I like this. She could probably get lots of shots there....though K.Mitchell might have something to say about it.
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myrtle
Joined: 02 May 2008 Posts: 32340
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Posted: 06/26/22 11:17 am ::: |
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J-Spoon wrote: |
Charles started in Conn and was there for a while, won an MVP, and the team had a decent level of success in her tenure. Conn's management fired the coach she liked Mike T and she left for NY (Can't remember if she was traded or signed as a free agent but I don't believe she forced her way out in any under handed fashion, but can't remember).
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My memory [could be flawed] was that she forced her way out of CT, saying she wanted to go home. I think that was when my opinion of her took a dive. Then came the info that she was giving her salary to charity and my opinion rose somewhat. But on the floor she's never seen a shot she doesn't like - which generally is not the type of player I particularly like.
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FrozenLVFan
Joined: 08 Jul 2014 Posts: 3518
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Posted: 06/26/22 11:23 am ::: |
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johnjohnW wrote: |
ChiSky54 wrote: |
Quote: |
Charles regularly made comments about wanting to either be traded, cut or divorced from her contract, a source said. Her divorce Saturday came together in a short amount of a time, a source said.
Before signing with the Mercury, Charles had narrowed her choices to Seattle and Phoenix, a source said, but a disagreement between the sides in how Charles would be used by the Storm led her to choose Phoenix. |
Hmmm...so if Seattle takes her now, has this desired role issue been resolved? |
Likely not, it's just her only hope of a title left.
I was fine when my team was on the receiving end of her ring chasing, so I'm not gonna be too made now that we're being burned by her ring chasing. #hateharddenied
Can Vegas afford her? Lol |
And what? Tell Plum, Wilson, and Young not to shoot so much? Charles could be a great asset coming off the bench but she won't be happy and it will be disruptive just like it was in PX.
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mercfan3
Joined: 23 Nov 2004 Posts: 19789
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Posted: 06/26/22 1:26 pm ::: |
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Queenie wrote: |
Quote: |
She had been unhappy with her role in the offense, which included a desire for more shots, for some time. |
She’s taking the seventh most shots in the league and the second most on her own team- more than DeShields, more than Taurasi- and she wants more shots. And she wants to go to the team that has two of the only six players in the league who do take more shots than she does? Just get a damn booster if you want more shots.
Quote: |
Charles expected to be used in a more active role in the wake of center Brittney Griner's absence this season but felt like she wasn't given the opportunity, a source said. |
The player who has practically developed an allergy to the paint and has a crippling addiction to taking 17-foot jumpers from 18 feet thought she was going to take the role of one of the best in-the-paint post players in the league? I’m sorry, what.
I cannot believe that I am in agreement with Sophie Cunningham, of all the fucking assholes, on this, but fuck Tina Charles. |
So she wanted to shoot more than Skylar? Jesus. And there were/are definitely times this season where I've felt Diana isn't taking enough shots.
During the bubble season, Phoenix looked better after BG left. (I believe the players love BG - I just think she wasn't mentally right, and that obviously impacts team chemistry.) Wouldn't surprise me if they look better without Tina too.
_________________ “Anyone point out that a Donald Trump anagram is ‘Lord Dampnut’”- Colin Mochrie
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Silky Johnson
Joined: 29 Sep 2014 Posts: 3325
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Posted: 06/26/22 2:10 pm ::: |
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mercfan3 wrote: |
During the bubble season, Phoenix looked better after BG left. (I believe the players love BG - I just think she wasn't mentally right, and that obviously impacts team chemistry.) Wouldn't surprise me if they look better without Tina too. |
To whatever extent that may have been true, I think it's worth noting that that really wasn't how it was being discussed at the time. It's funny how we only frame the discourse in that way, when it's about a player we don't like. Because, even when somebody may have literally used those exact words, "Phoenix looked better after BG left," they weren't being used as a referendum/indictment of Brittney Griner. And why not? Because that's what would be fair. But people don't care, because they like Griner; nobody was like, "Phoenix looks better since BG went home, and that proves that Brittney's a cancer, and nobody wants to play with her!"
_________________ Professional Hater. The Baron of #HateHard
My team no longer exists, so I'll have to settle for hating yours.
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mercfan3
Joined: 23 Nov 2004 Posts: 19789
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Posted: 06/26/22 2:40 pm ::: |
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Silky Johnson wrote: |
mercfan3 wrote: |
During the bubble season, Phoenix looked better after BG left. (I believe the players love BG - I just think she wasn't mentally right, and that obviously impacts team chemistry.) Wouldn't surprise me if they look better without Tina too. |
To whatever extent that may have been true, I think it's worth noting that that really wasn't how it was being discussed at the time. It's funny how we only frame the discourse in that way, when it's about a player we don't like. Because, even when somebody may have literally used those exact words, "Phoenix looked better after BG left," they weren't being used as a referendum/indictment of Brittney Griner. And why not? Because that's what would be fair. But people don't care, because they like Griner; nobody was like, "Phoenix looks better since BG went home, and that proves that Brittney's a cancer, and nobody wants to play with her!" |
I don’t say it in a way that is hating on Tina either.
If Tina was unhappy here - which I could see why..this team is not the one she thought she was signing too - that’s obviously going to impact the team.
It’s not the greatest thing in the world to leave your teammates high and dry - but again, addition BG subtraction. Doesn’t make sense sometimes..(and if she’s happy in Seattle and help gets Sue a ring on her way out - I won’t be upset)
_________________ “Anyone point out that a Donald Trump anagram is ‘Lord Dampnut’”- Colin Mochrie
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mercfan
Joined: 08 May 2013 Posts: 1910
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Posted: 06/26/22 3:05 pm ::: |
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Silky Johnson wrote: |
mercfan3 wrote: |
During the bubble season, Phoenix looked better after BG left. (I believe the players love BG - I just think she wasn't mentally right, and that obviously impacts team chemistry.) Wouldn't surprise me if they look better without Tina too. |
To whatever extent that may have been true, I think it's worth noting that that really wasn't how it was being discussed at the time. It's funny how we only frame the discourse in that way, when it's about a player we don't like. Because, even when somebody may have literally used those exact words, "Phoenix looked better after BG left," they weren't being used as a referendum/indictment of Brittney Griner. And why not? Because that's what would be fair. But people don't care, because they like Griner; nobody was like, "Phoenix looks better since BG went home, and that proves that Brittney's a cancer, and nobody wants to play with her!" |
While I see what you are saying I think MANY people had this sentiment when BG left. BG got a pass because we were in a global pandemic and fighting for civil rights. That is hard for a lot of people especially if you are playing year round basketball. Clearly BG needed a break and she came back the next season playing like an MVP.
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Silky Johnson
Joined: 29 Sep 2014 Posts: 3325
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Posted: 06/26/22 3:09 pm ::: |
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mercfan wrote: |
While I see what you are saying I think MANY people had this sentiment when BG left. BG got a pass because we were in a global pandemic and fighting for civil rights. That is hard for a lot of people especially if you are playing year round basketball. Clearly BG needed a break and she came back the next season playing like an MVP. |
You think that "MANY" people had the sentiment that Phoenix playing better after Griner went home was a referendum on Griner? I'd like to see some receipts on that.
_________________ Professional Hater. The Baron of #HateHard
My team no longer exists, so I'll have to settle for hating yours.
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