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Ex-Ref
Joined: 04 Oct 2009 Posts: 8949
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013 Posts: 7848 Location: Shenandoah Valley
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Posted: 05/30/16 9:27 pm ::: |
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Kim Mulkey has been very quiet so far...but this whole thing, IMNSHO, is a slap in the face to her and every other woman on the Baylor campus.
_________________ Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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FollowtheCardinalRule
Joined: 12 Oct 2011 Posts: 5153 Location: Denver
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Posted: 05/30/16 10:31 pm ::: |
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summertime blues wrote: |
Kim Mulkey has been very quiet so far...but this whole thing, IMNSHO, is a slap in the face to her and every other woman on the Baylor campus. |
I wonder what the ramifications, if any, will be for the Women's Basketball Program. Kim Mulkey could continue sailing--or in the face of everything that's happened--is it possible that she might jump ship for another prestigious job if it opens up? Very curious to see what happens with the program. There is of course the possibility that she stays, and makes the program continue to be the standard bearer for the university.
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013 Posts: 7848 Location: Shenandoah Valley
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Posted: 05/31/16 8:25 am ::: |
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If I were the parent of a young female player being recruited, this would automatically take Baylor off the list for my daughter. I would have to tell Kim, "Sorry, you have a great program, but I don't think Baylor is either a safe or a good *moral or ethical* environment for my daughter."
_________________ Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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NoDakSt
Joined: 26 Oct 2005 Posts: 4929
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Posted: 05/31/16 12:31 pm ::: |
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summertime blues wrote: |
If I were the parent of a young female player being recruited, this would automatically take Baylor off the list for my daughter. I would have to tell Kim, "Sorry, you have a great program, but I don't think Baylor is either a safe or a good *moral or ethical* environment for my daughter." |
It's a similar conversation that parents could have with Holly Warlick.
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FrozenLVFan
Joined: 08 Jul 2014 Posts: 3516
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Posted: 05/31/16 1:13 pm ::: |
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NoDakSt wrote: |
summertime blues wrote: |
If I were the parent of a young female player being recruited, this would automatically take Baylor off the list for my daughter. I would have to tell Kim, "Sorry, you have a great program, but I don't think Baylor is either a safe or a good *moral or ethical* environment for my daughter." |
It's a similar conversation that parents could have with Holly Warlick. |
Or with Steph White. Or the Dartmouth coaching staff. Or dozens of other colleges.
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ucbart
Joined: 21 Nov 2004 Posts: 2815 Location: New York
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Posted: 05/31/16 2:36 pm ::: |
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FrozenLVFan wrote: |
NoDakSt wrote: |
summertime blues wrote: |
If I were the parent of a young female player being recruited, this would automatically take Baylor off the list for my daughter. I would have to tell Kim, "Sorry, you have a great program, but I don't think Baylor is either a safe or a good *moral or ethical* environment for my daughter." |
It's a similar conversation that parents could have with Holly Warlick. |
Or with Steph White. Or the Dartmouth coaching staff. Or dozens of other colleges. |
I agree! I bet this kind of thing goes on at 90% of college campuses, if not higher, just not to this magnitude. Let's be honest, these college football and basketball players are allowed to run a muck around these college campuses/towns with 0 regard for anything really. And now we want to pay them? I absolutely hate where college athletics is headed....but it does make me happy that I'm a WCBB fan.
I do think it's funny that Baylor is in this position now with their holier than thou attitudes has this happen! You can't be a lesbian on the basketball team, but you can be a straight soccer player who gets raped by a football player. I hope Baylor never wins another game in any sport.
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Carol Anne
Joined: 09 Apr 2005 Posts: 1739 Location: Seattle
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Posted: 05/31/16 6:47 pm ::: |
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ucbart wrote: |
I agree! I bet this kind of thing goes on at 90% of college campuses, if not higher, just not to this magnitude. Let's be honest, these college football and basketball players are allowed to run a muck around these college campuses/towns with 0 regard for anything really. And now we want to pay them? I absolutely hate where college athletics is headed....but it does make me happy that I'm a WCBB fan.
I do think it's funny that Baylor is in this position now with their holier than thou attitudes has this happen! You can't be a lesbian on the basketball team, but you can be a straight soccer player who gets raped by a football player. I hope Baylor never wins another game in any sport. |
There have been lesbian basketball players at Baylor (and not just Brittney Griner) on Kim Mulkey's teams.
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009 Posts: 15740 Location: OREGON (in my heart)
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Posted: 05/31/16 7:55 pm ::: |
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ucbart wrote: |
I agree! I bet this kind of thing goes on at 90% of college campuses, if not higher, just not to this magnitude. Let's be honest, these college football and basketball players are allowed to run a muck around these college campuses/towns with 0 regard for anything really. And now we want to pay them? I absolutely hate where college athletics is headed....but it does make me happy that I'm a WCBB fan.
I do think it's funny that Baylor is in this position now with their holier than thou attitudes has this happen! You can't be a lesbian on the basketball team, but you can be a straight soccer player who gets raped by a football player. I hope Baylor never wins another game in any sport. |
Trusting you'd want to be a consistent person in your *hoping*, you might find yourself wishing a whole TON of schools "never win another game in any sport".
I'm not necessarily a huge Baylor fan, but I always think they get an unfair rap in these circumstances. Just because they're of religious origin doesn't mean they're free of flawed people. In fact, it's to their credit that they're working to rectify the wrongs here. Young men/athletes who rape can be found on any campus, no? And many, MANY schools have written policies against homosexuality. Baylor doesn't deserve to be the whipping boy for all of 'em.
I daresay Kim's young ladies are perfectly capable of taking care of themselves, and probably among the least vulnerable rape victims on campus.
_________________ Oregon: Go Ducks!
"Inévitablement, les canards voleront"
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FrozenLVFan
Joined: 08 Jul 2014 Posts: 3516
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Posted: 05/31/16 11:25 pm ::: |
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Howee wrote: |
I daresay Kim's young ladies are perfectly capable of taking care of themselves, and probably among the least vulnerable rape victims on campus. |
I don't think that's a valid assumption. There are numerous reports of collegiate female athletes becoming rape victims at a lot of schools. One Baylor victim was a soccer player. Being in very good physical shape doesn't protect a woman from being raped.
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009 Posts: 15740 Location: OREGON (in my heart)
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Posted: 06/01/16 12:28 am ::: |
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FrozenLVFan wrote: |
Howee wrote: |
I daresay Kim's young ladies are perfectly capable of taking care of themselves, and probably among the least vulnerable rape victims on campus. |
I don't think that's a valid assumption. There are numerous reports of collegiate female athletes becoming rape victims at a lot of schools. One Baylor victim was a soccer player. Being in very good physical shape doesn't protect a woman from being raped. |
I dunno....before I could dismiss the validity of that assumption, I'd have to see hard stats on how athlete victims compare/contrast in numbers to other demographic groups on campus.
Being in very good physical shape wasn't my only implication: I'm thinking that being within a group where teammates have your back, and so much of your non-class time is spent together in a demanding program are all factors that help these kids to have better odds of NOT being victims of such things as rape.
And all of THAT is in response to people who might think their daughter isn't safe in Kim's program. A high-profile program like Kim's is likely to be as "safe" as any to be found in a co-ed setting anywhere else.
_________________ Oregon: Go Ducks!
"Inévitablement, les canards voleront"
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FrozenLVFan
Joined: 08 Jul 2014 Posts: 3516
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Posted: 06/01/16 9:15 am ::: |
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Howee wrote: |
FrozenLVFan wrote: |
Howee wrote: |
I daresay Kim's young ladies are perfectly capable of taking care of themselves, and probably among the least vulnerable rape victims on campus. |
I don't think that's a valid assumption. There are numerous reports of collegiate female athletes becoming rape victims at a lot of schools. One Baylor victim was a soccer player. Being in very good physical shape doesn't protect a woman from being raped. |
I dunno....before I could dismiss the validity of that assumption, I'd have to see hard stats on how athlete victims compare/contrast in numbers to other demographic groups on campus.
Being in very good physical shape wasn't my only implication: I'm thinking that being within a group where teammates have your back, and so much of your non-class time is spent together in a demanding program are all factors that help these kids to have better odds of NOT being victims of such things as rape.
And all of THAT is in response to people who might think their daughter isn't safe in Kim's program. A high-profile program like Kim's is likely to be as "safe" as any to be found in a co-ed setting anywhere else. |
I don't think Kim's players are any more or less safe than players in any other school. Maybe female athletes are at less risk of being sexually assaulted than non-athletes due to the things you mentioned, but their risk is still nowhere near zero.
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ucbart
Joined: 21 Nov 2004 Posts: 2815 Location: New York
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Posted: 06/01/16 10:20 am ::: |
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Carol Anne wrote: |
ucbart wrote: |
I agree! I bet this kind of thing goes on at 90% of college campuses, if not higher, just not to this magnitude. Let's be honest, these college football and basketball players are allowed to run a muck around these college campuses/towns with 0 regard for anything really. And now we want to pay them? I absolutely hate where college athletics is headed....but it does make me happy that I'm a WCBB fan.
I do think it's funny that Baylor is in this position now with their holier than thou attitudes has this happen! You can't be a lesbian on the basketball team, but you can be a straight soccer player who gets raped by a football player. I hope Baylor never wins another game in any sport. |
There have been lesbian basketball players at Baylor (and not just Brittney Griner) on Kim Mulkey's teams. |
I know this, but they can't be out is what I was getting at......
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013 Posts: 7848 Location: Shenandoah Valley
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Posted: 06/01/16 11:35 am ::: |
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ucbart wrote: |
Carol Anne wrote: |
ucbart wrote: |
I agree! I bet this kind of thing goes on at 90% of college campuses, if not higher, just not to this magnitude. Let's be honest, these college football and basketball players are allowed to run a muck around these college campuses/towns with 0 regard for anything really. And now we want to pay them? I absolutely hate where college athletics is headed....but it does make me happy that I'm a WCBB fan.
I do think it's funny that Baylor is in this position now with their holier than thou attitudes has this happen! You can't be a lesbian on the basketball team, but you can be a straight soccer player who gets raped by a football player. I hope Baylor never wins another game in any sport. |
There have been lesbian basketball players at Baylor (and not just Brittney Griner) on Kim Mulkey's teams. |
I know this, but they can't be out is what I was getting at...... |
This is a point I was about to make, so thank you for making it. Griner was told by Mulkey that she couldn't be out, although I've heard that everyone on campus pretty much knew she was gay and knew who her gf was. Baylor is very hypocritical as many religious schools are. Recently BYU has been very much in the news in this respect also for their treatment of sexual assault victims. It's being reported that women students who have been sexually assaulted are afraid to report their assaults to the school because *they* are the ones who are then investigated for supposed violations of the school's "honor code". Victim blaming in the extreme....kind of makes it sound like Afghanistan in the Wasatch!
OTOH, Oregon State has done a 180 on how they handle sexual assault, largely due to the efforts of one former student's communication with the president of the university. You can read about it here http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/oregon-state-university-sexual-assault_us_56f426c3e4b02c402f66c3b9
_________________ Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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linkster
Joined: 27 Jul 2012 Posts: 5423
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Posted: 06/01/16 1:04 pm ::: |
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I agree that the problem of sexual assault isn't exclusive to to any school or geographic area. But there is a great deal of difference among states as to the legal standards applied and legal protections provided to victims of such assaults. That also applies to protections for LGBT laws, which vary from state to state.
If I were a parent of a LGBT athlete, the state I would want my child attending school would definitely be a factor in my advise to them.
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FrozenLVFan
Joined: 08 Jul 2014 Posts: 3516
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Posted: 06/01/16 1:20 pm ::: |
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linkster wrote: |
I agree that the problem of sexual assault isn't exclusive to to any school or geographic area. But there is a great deal of difference among states as to the legal standards applied and legal protections provided to victims of such assaults. That also applies to protections for LGBT laws, which vary from state to state. |
This is true as far as it goes. The real problem is that many schools elect to handle sexual assaults through their own disciplinary systems which are heavily influenced by any number of school factors, and the local or state legal systems are never involved.
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cthskzfn
Joined: 21 Nov 2004 Posts: 12851 Location: In a world where a PSYCHOpath like Trump isn't potus.
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Posted: 06/01/16 2:47 pm ::: |
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That Ken Starr is involved is icing on the cake.
_________________ Silly, stupid white people might be waking up.
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FrozenLVFan
Joined: 08 Jul 2014 Posts: 3516
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Posted: 06/01/16 5:42 pm ::: |
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cthskzfn wrote: |
That Ken Starr is involved is icing on the cake. |
No, the dubious icing is that he's been demoted to teaching ethics at the law school.
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