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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 66773 Location: Where the action is
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Posted: 04/19/16 3:42 pm ::: Series of allegations against coaches marks troubling trend |
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http://espn.go.com/womens-college-basketball/story/_/id/15270836/series-allegations-abuse-women-basketball-coaches-marks-troubling-trend
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On one hand, the incidents can be looked at as related, or even part of a trend. However, it's critical to also look at each case individually when these situations occur. Because they are not all the same. There are coaches who abuse their power, and have to be held accountable. But there are also players who blame coaches for their own failures and disappointments, and who set out to wreck careers and reputations that are decades in the making. That's a terrifying threat to coaches, and it's understandable why they might feel their profession is under siege. |
_________________ Let us not deceive ourselves. Our educational institutions have proven to be no bastions of democracy.
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FrozenLVFan
Joined: 08 Jul 2014 Posts: 3510
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005 Posts: 11105
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Posted: 04/20/16 4:55 pm ::: |
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These kids today ...
_________________ Oṃ Tāre Tuttāre Ture Svāhā
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013 Posts: 7746 Location: Shenandoah Valley
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Posted: 04/20/16 7:02 pm ::: |
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I think she has a point here. Social media has made a difference in the last few years, and it's not necessarily a good one. There are a few college coaches that have restricted their team members' use of social media during the season, and it hasn't been a popular move. There are also some players who have an awful attitude and can poison a team. And there are a lot of kids who do have a "me first" attitude, period. I saw it when my kids played sports 20+ years ago, so it's not new, but I think increased publicity and social media do a lot to spread it and make it worse.
_________________ Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 66773 Location: Where the action is
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Posted: 04/20/16 7:12 pm ::: |
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Social media has made a big difference. Used to be the coaches didn't know when players were going out partying.
_________________ Let us not deceive ourselves. Our educational institutions have proven to be no bastions of democracy.
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FrozenLVFan
Joined: 08 Jul 2014 Posts: 3510
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Posted: 04/20/16 8:22 pm ::: |
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I think social media, cell phones, and instant communication in general have decreased self-reliance and increased the need for affirmation from others. Witness people, both young and adults, trying to make a selection at the deli or pizza place without calling 4 other people for their input.
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snzuluz
Joined: 10 Aug 2007 Posts: 176
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Posted: 04/21/16 6:59 am ::: |
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as someone who has taught and coached on the K- graduate school level, it doesn't matter what age group you coach...we have created a generation of young parents and athletes who have been stickered to death so they feel better about themselves, we give everyone a trophy so no one will have hurt feelings, and most coaches would tell you they would love to coach a team of orphans...it is the 'P word" PARENTS that entitle their kids in the 21st century...our athletes and students want for nothing...and expect to have everything handed to them
kids can be a fee waiver in the K-12 public school setting, but they walk around with smart phones, $100 tennis shoes, and play on travel teams...athletes today do not sacrifice as much as those of tester-year...
technology will be the death of society and we see it every day with young people, athletes, and parents...no reason you should turn off your cell phone during an awards night or heaven forbid graduation ceremonies at all levels of education...
those who work hard each and every day to make it in any level of sports used to the rule...now unfortunately, they are the exception...if i don't get my way because i was a big fish in a little pond in high school and now i am a little fish in a big pond in college, it MUST be the coaches fault...
more athletes and even parents need to point the finger inward towards themselves and they are always the only constant factor in any situation, instead of pointing their finger outward toward the coach or the "system".
yes, we have coaches who probably should not be working with young people or their antics on the sideline bring all the attention to themselves instead of the athlete ( KM - Baylor coach) but as long as administrators tolerate that behavior then coaches will abuse players either verbally, mentally, or physically and get away with it...
JPM at Duke has had those rumors for many years surrounding her and NOW administration finally wants to do something about it...sort of like Bobby Knight finally getting his due for his behavior...
many of our coaches as long as they are winning get to keep acting the way they do, because administration is too lazy to do something about it...it is up to administration to address the problem and work on it with a coach..."best practice" is the term used in public school educational settings for teachers...if teachers or professors acted and spoke to students in their classes like some coaches do, they would be fired and so should coaches who are shown to be abusive...
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Oldfandepot2
Joined: 05 Jul 2013 Posts: 996 Location: Northeast
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Posted: 04/21/16 7:34 am ::: |
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About a year ago on a post game show right after Geno had benched Stewart and Tuck causing great consternation about how he unfairly treated the both, Kara Wolters recounted how Geno's treatment of players was far more harsh than it is today. She recalled in one of her very first practices, she was not paying attention like Geno wanted and he threw her out of practice.
She said she thought after a few minutes he would let her back in and when she opened the door and asked to come back he threw the ball with force right at her head.
Those days where the coaches reigned supreme in a feudal system are going as players are being taught as individuals that respect given is respect earned. Some players like coaches see it as a one way street others see it for what it should be, a road that must mutually go both ways.
We are evolving as our understanding of the physiology of the young mind works and why becomes more apparent; therefore do young players need discipline and guidance, sure they do but do they have to be physically and mentally abused to obtain it, no.
The advent of social media merely gives a forum to advocate publically for themselves whether we agree with it or not.
_________________ Cave Canem!
We must listen to each other no matter how much it hurts. Bishop Desmond Tutu.
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005 Posts: 11105
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Posted: 04/21/16 12:49 pm ::: |
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technology will be the death of society and we see it every day with young people, athletes, and parents...no reason you should turn off your cell phone during an awards night or heaven forbid graduation ceremonies at all levels of education... |
In the sixth and seventh centuries BCE, the old-timers decried the use of writing, which they were certain would be the death of society because young people would no longer have to memorize everything. The logical conclusion was that their brains would rot, and culture would disappear in a bout of laziness and supposed learning (people wouldn't have to memorize things, they could just look them up, so they wouldn't be as smart.)
Similar rants have been delivered through the centuries, all beginning with two premises:
1) Kids today aren't anywhere near the quality of their grandparents;
2) Modern technology (railroads, telephones, televisions) will destroy humanity.
Sure, social media has changed things. Yes, figures of authority have to be more careful.
But consider this: The Luddites say that constant texting, etc., means people don't communicate any more, and they point to people sitting at a table not talking to each other but on their phones. But they're communicating with other people, maybe more than one, so how is that not communicating? If the face-to-face thing is so critical, then telephones are much worse, because you can only talk to one person at a time.
A bunch of teens sitting in a circle on their phones will share videos, music, gossip and be constantly communicating, sometimes with the ones in their physical presence, sometimes not.
This, somehow, is awful behavior and worthy of condemnation but two teens talking on the phone for an hour in the '60s is an example of the good old days.
[End of predictable rant -- I have to go out and beat a dead horse now ...]
_________________ Oṃ Tāre Tuttāre Ture Svāhā
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readyAIMfire53
Joined: 20 Nov 2004 Posts: 7355 Location: Durham, NC
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Posted: 04/21/16 6:42 pm ::: |
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ClayK wrote: |
Quote: |
technology will be the death of society and we see it every day with young people, athletes, and parents...no reason you should turn off your cell phone during an awards night or heaven forbid graduation ceremonies at all levels of education... |
In the sixth and seventh centuries BCE, the old-timers decried the use of writing, which they were certain would be the death of society because young people would no longer have to memorize everything. The logical conclusion was that their brains would rot, and culture would disappear in a bout of laziness and supposed learning (people wouldn't have to memorize things, they could just look them up, so they wouldn't be as smart.)
Similar rants have been delivered through the centuries, all beginning with two premises:
1) Kids today aren't anywhere near the quality of their grandparents;
2) Modern technology (railroads, telephones, televisions) will destroy humanity.
Sure, social media has changed things. Yes, figures of authority have to be more careful.
But consider this: The Luddites say that constant texting, etc., means people don't communicate any more, and they point to people sitting at a table not talking to each other but on their phones. But they're communicating with other people, maybe more than one, so how is that not communicating? If the face-to-face thing is so critical, then telephones are much worse, because you can only talk to one person at a time.
A bunch of teens sitting in a circle on their phones will share videos, music, gossip and be constantly communicating, sometimes with the ones in their physical presence, sometimes not.
This, somehow, is awful behavior and worthy of condemnation but two teens talking on the phone for an hour in the '60s is an example of the good old days.
[End of predictable rant -- I have to go out and beat a dead horse now ...] |
Thank you Clay for saying - more eloquently than I would have - what I was thinking while reading the whining about the younger generation. Things change. Change with them or get left behind. Geno is a master at changing with the times as are all great coaches, teachers, parents, etc.
I am sick to death of coaches that whine about coddled millenials as camouflage for not treating them decently. Y'all need to stop being stereotypical old folks complaining about spoiled young folks. These are the folks we are leaving the world to and they're likely going to do at least as good as we're doing. Or better. Hopefully better.
_________________ Follow your passion and your life will be true down to your core.
~rAf
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StevenHW
Joined: 25 Jul 2005 Posts: 10979 Location: Sacramento, California
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Posted: 04/21/16 7:00 pm ::: |
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ClayK wrote: |
Quote: |
technology will be the death of society and we see it every day with young people, athletes, and parents...no reason you should turn off your cell phone during an awards night or heaven forbid graduation ceremonies at all levels of education... |
In the sixth and seventh centuries BCE, the old-timers decried the use of writing, which they were certain would be the death of society because young people would no longer have to memorize everything. The logical conclusion was that their brains would rot, and culture would disappear in a bout of laziness and supposed learning (people wouldn't have to memorize things, they could just look them up, so they wouldn't be as smart.)
Similar rants have been delivered through the centuries, all beginning with two premises:
1) Kids today aren't anywhere near the quality of their grandparents;
2) Modern technology (railroads, telephones, televisions) will destroy humanity.
Sure, social media has changed things. Yes, figures of authority have to be more careful.
But consider this: The Luddites say that constant texting, etc., means people don't communicate any more, and they point to people sitting at a table not talking to each other but on their phones. But they're communicating with other people, maybe more than one, so how is that not communicating? If the face-to-face thing is so critical, then telephones are much worse, because you can only talk to one person at a time.
A bunch of teens sitting in a circle on their phones will share videos, music, gossip and be constantly communicating, sometimes with the ones in their physical presence, sometimes not.
This, somehow, is awful behavior and worthy of condemnation but two teens talking on the phone for an hour in the '60s is an example of the good old days.
[End of predictable rant -- I have to go out and beat a dead horse now ...] |
"Let others praise ancient times; I am glad I was born in these." --- Ovid, ancient Roman poet
_________________ "The more I see of the moneyed classes, the more I understand the guillotine." -- George Bernard Shaw
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cthskzfn
Joined: 21 Nov 2004 Posts: 12851 Location: In a world where a PSYCHOpath like Trump isn't potus.
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Posted: 04/22/16 7:37 am ::: |
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readyAIMfire53 wrote: |
ClayK wrote: |
Quote: |
technology will be the death of society and we see it every day with young people, athletes, and parents...no reason you should turn off your cell phone during an awards night or heaven forbid graduation ceremonies at all levels of education... |
In the sixth and seventh centuries BCE, the old-timers decried the use of writing, which they were certain would be the death of society because young people would no longer have to memorize everything. The logical conclusion was that their brains would rot, and culture would disappear in a bout of laziness and supposed learning (people wouldn't have to memorize things, they could just look them up, so they wouldn't be as smart.)
Similar rants have been delivered through the centuries, all beginning with two premises:
1) Kids today aren't anywhere near the quality of their grandparents;
2) Modern technology (railroads, telephones, televisions) will destroy humanity.
Sure, social media has changed things. Yes, figures of authority have to be more careful.
But consider this: The Luddites say that constant texting, etc., means people don't communicate any more, and they point to people sitting at a table not talking to each other but on their phones. But they're communicating with other people, maybe more than one, so how is that not communicating? If the face-to-face thing is so critical, then telephones are much worse, because you can only talk to one person at a time.
A bunch of teens sitting in a circle on their phones will share videos, music, gossip and be constantly communicating, sometimes with the ones in their physical presence, sometimes not.
This, somehow, is awful behavior and worthy of condemnation but two teens talking on the phone for an hour in the '60s is an example of the good old days.
[End of predictable rant -- I have to go out and beat a dead horse now ...] |
Thank you Clay for saying - more eloquently than I would have - what I was thinking while reading the whining about the younger generation. Things change. Change with them or get left behind. Geno is a master at changing with the times as are all great coaches, teachers, parents, etc.
I am sick to death of coaches that whine about coddled millenials as camouflage for not treating them decently. Y'all need to stop being stereotypical old folks complaining about spoiled young folks. These are the folks we are leaving the world to and they're likely going to do at least as good as we're doing. Or better. Hopefully better. |
And yet he prohibits team members from engaging in social media from first practice to the team's final game of the season.
Imo, he gets it
Cell phones should be banned from K-12 schools.
How's that for old fogey?
_________________ Silly, stupid white people might be waking up.
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005 Posts: 11105
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Posted: 04/22/16 9:23 am ::: |
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Cell phones should be banned from K-12 schools. |
So I was teaching a mini-term on sports and society at a high school, and as we were talking, a topic came up that related to something that just had happened. So I said, "OK, check it out on your phones" -- and the entire class was now together, seeing the same thing at the same time. It was spontaneous, and if not for cell phones, I couldn't have done that.
I used to print out my scouting reports for games (three pages, usually), but now I just e-mail them and have the kids open them on their phones while I go over them.
A few weeks ago, we had a lockdown near the end of school. Every kid could contact whoever was picking him or her up directly, immediately, and tell them to stay away.
Homework on the board? Take a picture with your cell phone. Want to find out Andrew Jackson's date of birth for a paper? Look on your phone.
Of course phones are abused. So were computers. So were pieces of paper (passing notes, remember?).
[Sorry -- the caffeine kicked in at the wrong time ...]
_________________ Oṃ Tāre Tuttāre Ture Svāhā
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patsweetpat
Joined: 14 Jul 2010 Posts: 2306 Location: Culver City, CA
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Posted: 04/22/16 5:23 pm ::: |
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If Clay tries to defend this newfangled rock and roll, I swear to God, he's lost me forever.
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readyAIMfire53
Joined: 20 Nov 2004 Posts: 7355 Location: Durham, NC
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Posted: 04/22/16 7:13 pm ::: |
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cthskzfn wrote: |
readyAIMfire53 wrote: |
ClayK wrote: |
Quote: |
technology will be the death of society and we see it every day with young people, athletes, and parents...no reason you should turn off your cell phone during an awards night or heaven forbid graduation ceremonies at all levels of education... |
In the sixth and seventh centuries BCE, the old-timers decried the use of writing, which they were certain would be the death of society because young people would no longer have to memorize everything. The logical conclusion was that their brains would rot, and culture would disappear in a bout of laziness and supposed learning (people wouldn't have to memorize things, they could just look them up, so they wouldn't be as smart.)
Similar rants have been delivered through the centuries, all beginning with two premises:
1) Kids today aren't anywhere near the quality of their grandparents;
2) Modern technology (railroads, telephones, televisions) will destroy humanity.
Sure, social media has changed things. Yes, figures of authority have to be more careful.
But consider this: The Luddites say that constant texting, etc., means people don't communicate any more, and they point to people sitting at a table not talking to each other but on their phones. But they're communicating with other people, maybe more than one, so how is that not communicating? If the face-to-face thing is so critical, then telephones are much worse, because you can only talk to one person at a time.
A bunch of teens sitting in a circle on their phones will share videos, music, gossip and be constantly communicating, sometimes with the ones in their physical presence, sometimes not.
This, somehow, is awful behavior and worthy of condemnation but two teens talking on the phone for an hour in the '60s is an example of the good old days.
[End of predictable rant -- I have to go out and beat a dead horse now ...] |
Thank you Clay for saying - more eloquently than I would have - what I was thinking while reading the whining about the younger generation. Things change. Change with them or get left behind. Geno is a master at changing with the times as are all great coaches, teachers, parents, etc.
I am sick to death of coaches that whine about coddled millenials as camouflage for not treating them decently. Y'all need to stop being stereotypical old folks complaining about spoiled young folks. These are the folks we are leaving the world to and they're likely going to do at least as good as we're doing. Or better. Hopefully better. |
And yet he prohibits team members from engaging in social media from first practice to the team's final game of the season.
Imo, he gets it
Cell phones should be banned from K-12 schools.
How's that for old fogey? |
You are describing a master. Exactly. He doesn't whine about "millennials." He just says "this is my team and this is my rule for being on the team." I expect the coach to set clear rules just like they always have. The use of social media is no different.
And, by the way, by suggesting students at K-12 schools should not have cell phones shows you have not raised a kid during the age of cell phones. Trying to coordinate "where is my kid" and "when are they ready for pick up" at an after school event was a nightmare of hunting/parking/searching/spending time you do not have while fearing they've been kidnapped/mugged. The conversation needs to go like this "keep the phone turned OFF in the bottom of your backpack and if you pull it out in class and get it confiscated, you will be grounded from all activities until you've earned the money for a new phone."
_________________ Follow your passion and your life will be true down to your core.
~rAf
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FrozenLVFan
Joined: 08 Jul 2014 Posts: 3510
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Posted: 04/22/16 7:26 pm ::: |
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Criticism of behaviors associated with cell phone usage is in no way limited to kids. Adults are just as bad, or worse because they should know better. Who here has not had a meeting or lecture interrupted by ringing cell phones or a sat at a dinner table where adults kept texting or checking Facebook?
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Luuuc #NATC
Joined: 10 Feb 2005 Posts: 21903
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Posted: 04/23/16 10:29 pm ::: |
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FrozenLVFan wrote: |
Criticism of behaviors associated with cell phone usage is in no way limited to kids. Adults are just as bad, or worse because they should know better. Who here has not had a meeting or lecture interrupted by ringing cell phones or a sat at a dinner table where adults kept texting or checking Facebook? |
Amen. Too many adults are setting terrible examples for kids about what is normal/acceptable/polite.
_________________ Thanks for calling. I wait all night for calls like these.
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009 Posts: 15691 Location: OREGON (in my heart)
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Posted: 04/24/16 12:57 am ::: |
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Good article. I dunno---she mentioned snapchat and twitter, but I didn't get the message that this writer was blaming social media; rather, it was an indictment of how parents are fostering some of this "MeFirst/I'mAmazing" attitude in their precious offspring. This is, of course, not conducive to the Team First mentality the author describes in her own collegiate experience, and she's bemoaning the erosion of that selflessness.
Has selfishness always been present in these settings? Probably.
Is it more apparent than ever (thankyousocialmedia)? Probably.
_________________ Oregon: Go Ducks!
"Inévitablement, les canards voleront"
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