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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005
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 Posted: 09/03/14 7:48 am ::: |
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The whole conference issue is a complex one, but as always, I don't think women's basketball will have much impact on how the conference does as a whole -- that will come from football and/or men's basketball.
I don't think players care much about conference opponents. They are interested in the competitiveness of the team in postseason, facilities, education and TV exposure, none of which are affected by whether you play Syracuse or Temple. So direct recruiting shouldn't be impacted too much.
But the success of the conference as a whole will trickle down to women's basketball in terms of budgets. If football/TV money shrinks, if alumni are less likely to donate, if the importance of athletics to the school as a whole drops off, then women's basketball will be affected.
Two obvious areas would be recruiting budgets and coaching salaries -- if those decrease, then most likely the women's basketball team will get worse.
Ideally, of course, a team would be highly successful in a power five conference, but I think a consistently nationally ranked team with good facilities, a good academic reputation, solid administrative support and good TV exposure should be able to compete at a high level (think Gonzaga).
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GlennMacGrady
Joined: 03 Jan 2005
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| Posted: 09/03/14 10:20 am ::: |
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The entire conference feeling of local and traditional rivalry schools is now gone for UConn in the AAC. This will likely negatively affect attendance, which has already been on a downslide.
Even before the Big East, schools like Providence and Boston College were traditional New England UConn rivals. Now gone.
In the Big East, UConn was famous for busing hundreds if not thousands of fans from Connecticut to away games at these semi-local schools and others such as Seton Hall, Rutgers, St. Johns, Villanova and even Syracuse. Now all gone. No more Husky caravans to away games.
There are fans in Connecticut who attended, or have family who attended, these fairly local schools and who had been familiar with those schools all their lives as friendly rivals. All that familiarity and conference "family feeling" is now gone, as all the AAC schools are from remote places, alien to the People's Republic of Nutmeg.
UConn's two "longest term" conference rivals are now Cincinnati and South Florida. How many UConn fans will be motivated to attend a Houston, Central Florida or Eastern Carolina game? We'll see.
Every original Big East school managed over the years to get into a different, and now stronger, conference except for UConn. Part of that lies at the feet of AD's and presidents without much vision, and at least one who seemed to have poor touch with important alumni.
Of course the UConn women's basketball team will remain strong as long as the cult of Geno is there, although recruiting may begin to slowly erode. I think recruiting for all the other sports will be affected more quickly, including men's basketball.
The fans suffer the most. And they hold the purse strings. |
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Nixtreefan
Joined: 14 Nov 2012
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| Posted: 09/03/14 11:18 am ::: Show me the money |
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| Could you let us know Glenn, how much of the Uconn budget comes from ticket sales as opposed to boosters, name recognition revenue etc?
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GlennMacGrady
Joined: 03 Jan 2005
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Location: Heisenberg
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| Posted: 09/03/14 11:39 am ::: |
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I could let you know, Nixtreefan, that you are as capable of using Google as anyone else. What are you, one of the rude and arrogant UConn fans who just trolls anyone who says anything remotely negative about your sacred icons?
I do believe the new Big East got a bigger basketball TV contract than the AAC. But you can do your own research. |
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 09/03/14 12:05 pm ::: Re: Show me the money |
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| Nixtreefan wrote: |
| Could you let us know Glenn, how much of the Uconn budget comes from ticket sales as opposed to boosters, name recognition revenue etc? |
Just curious. What is "name recognition revenue"?
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linkster
Joined: 27 Jul 2012
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| Posted: 09/03/14 12:12 pm ::: |
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Lots of jibber jabber about how athletic revenue drives the budgets of wcbb. So how are the top 25 revenue schools (2013 figures) doing as far as success in women's basketball?
No in () is the school's rank in funding women's basketball. $$ is athletic revenue.
1 (8.) $165,691,488 Texas (BIG12) Longhorns
2 (193) $146,366,400 Wisconsin (BIG10)
3 (41) $143,393,056 Alabama (SEC)
4 (47) $129,505,648 Florida (SEC)
5 (4) $123,805,664 Oklahoma (BIG12)
6 (5) $123,604,624 Ohio State (BIG10)
7 (42) $122,742,256 Michigan (BIG10)
8 (23) $117,457,400 Louisiana State (SEC)
9 (20) $109,925,352 Tennessee (SEC)
10 (6) $108,509,680 Notre Dame (ACC)
11 (19) $106,703,776 Iowa (BIG10)
12 (13) $104,751,472 Penn State (BIG10)
13 (9) $102,864,768 Auburn (SEC)
14 (26) $99,769,096 Arkansas (SEC)
15 (64) $98,203,200 Minnesota (BIG10)
16 (18.) $98,120,888 Georgia (SEC)
17 (65) $97,802,256 Southern California (PAC12)
18 (17) $96,193,328 Louisville (AMER)
19 (27) $92,873,192 Kansas (BIG12)
20 (35) $91,815,128 California (PAC12)
21 (24) $90,490,232 Stanford (PAC12)
22 (21) $90,484,424 South Carolina (SEC)
23 (16) $89,145,160 Florida State (ACC)
24 (34) $86,916,000 Nebraska (BIG10)
25 (12) $86,570,576 Kentucky (SEC)
As can be seen, all that football money hasn't done much for women's BB at Alabama or Wisc or many schools not named Tenn or Notre Dame. It's very easy to simply make unsupported statements but how about some figures to back up the opinion that football money is the path to success in wbb.
And an interesting obsevation is that the ACC, sespite having aguably the best wbb conference, only has 3 teams in the top 25 revenue schools (and that's counting Louisville).
http://www.wbbstate.com/info/teams-revenue
http://www.wbbstate.com/info/teams-hoopsbudget
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Nixtreefan
Joined: 14 Nov 2012
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| Posted: 09/03/14 12:18 pm ::: Someones having a bad day. |
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My question was - would a drop in ticket revenue greatly affect a school like Uconns budget or do they make enough money from other revenue!
Some schools have huge booster contributions!
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beknighted
Joined: 11 Nov 2004
Posts: 11050
Location: Lost in D.C.
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| Posted: 09/03/14 1:03 pm ::: |
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| linkster wrote: |
Lots of jibber jabber about how athletic revenue drives the budgets of wcbb. So how are the top 25 revenue schools (2013 figures) doing as far as success in women's basketball?
* * * *
As can be seen, all that football money hasn't done much for women's BB at Alabama or Wisc or many schools not named Tenn or Notre Dame. It's very easy to simply make unsupported statements but how about some figures to back up the opinion that football money is the path to success in wbb.
And an interesting obsevation is that the ACC, sespite having aguably the best wbb conference, only has 3 teams in the top 25 revenue schools (and that's counting Louisville).
http://www.wbbstate.com/info/teams-revenue
http://www.wbbstate.com/info/teams-hoopsbudget |
A good general rule is that revenue from football goes back into football, or into facilities that benefit football (and perhaps other sports incidentally). Of course, the rising tide does have some effect on all boat, except perhaps at Wisconsin.
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purduefanatic
Joined: 10 Aug 2011
Posts: 2819
Location: Indiana
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| Posted: 09/03/14 2:43 pm ::: |
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| beknighted wrote: |
| linkster wrote: |
Lots of jibber jabber about how athletic revenue drives the budgets of wcbb. So how are the top 25 revenue schools (2013 figures) doing as far as success in women's basketball?
* * * *
As can be seen, all that football money hasn't done much for women's BB at Alabama or Wisc or many schools not named Tenn or Notre Dame. It's very easy to simply make unsupported statements but how about some figures to back up the opinion that football money is the path to success in wbb.
And an interesting obsevation is that the ACC, sespite having aguably the best wbb conference, only has 3 teams in the top 25 revenue schools (and that's counting Louisville).
http://www.wbbstate.com/info/teams-revenue
http://www.wbbstate.com/info/teams-hoopsbudget |
A good general rule is that revenue from football goes back into football, or into facilities that benefit football (and perhaps other sports incidentally). Of course, the rising tide does have some effect on all boat, except perhaps at Wisconsin. |
Well that's not quite true. The majority of TV revenue that a school generates is through the football deals with the networks & cable/satellite providers as well as the advertising dollars that something like the Big Ten Network gets from commercial slots. That money goes to benefit the entire athletic department. I know this money comes through the conference offices for the most part but it is generated mostly from football and men's basketball.
IMO, this is where UConn will eventually feel it in their "wallet". The AAC as constructed will NOT demand good money for the football product it produces and the basketball money will be limited as well.
I get a chuckle out of people that say that the change of conferences hasn't seemed to effect UConn yet. Well no kidding. It won't happen overnight and there hasn't even been a UConn basketball game played with the AAC logo on their court. The decline will be very minimal if at all with Geno at the helm...but when he retires, it's a whole new ball game.
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beknighted
Joined: 11 Nov 2004
Posts: 11050
Location: Lost in D.C.
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| Posted: 09/03/14 3:07 pm ::: |
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| purduefanatic wrote: |
| beknighted wrote: |
| linkster wrote: |
Lots of jibber jabber about how athletic revenue drives the budgets of wcbb. So how are the top 25 revenue schools (2013 figures) doing as far as success in women's basketball?
* * * *
As can be seen, all that football money hasn't done much for women's BB at Alabama or Wisc or many schools not named Tenn or Notre Dame. It's very easy to simply make unsupported statements but how about some figures to back up the opinion that football money is the path to success in wbb.
And an interesting obsevation is that the ACC, sespite having aguably the best wbb conference, only has 3 teams in the top 25 revenue schools (and that's counting Louisville).
http://www.wbbstate.com/info/teams-revenue
http://www.wbbstate.com/info/teams-hoopsbudget |
A good general rule is that revenue from football goes back into football, or into facilities that benefit football (and perhaps other sports incidentally). Of course, the rising tide does have some effect on all boat, except perhaps at Wisconsin. |
Well that's not quite true. The majority of TV revenue that a school generates is through the football deals with the networks & cable/satellite providers as well as the advertising dollars that something like the Big Ten Network gets from commercial slots. That money goes to benefit the entire athletic department. I know this money comes through the conference offices for the most part but it is generated mostly from football and men's basketball.
IMO, this is where UConn will eventually feel it in their "wallet". The AAC as constructed will NOT demand good money for the football product it produces and the basketball money will be limited as well.
I get a chuckle out of people that say that the change of conferences hasn't seemed to effect UConn yet. Well no kidding. It won't happen overnight and there hasn't even been a UConn basketball game played with the AAC logo on their court. The decline will be very minimal if at all with Geno at the helm...but when he retires, it's a whole new ball game. |
Football does tend to suck up a very high percentage of the revenue it generates - there are plenty of high-profile D-I programs that don't really make that much money from football when you do the accounting.
Anyway, I agree with your final point about UConn, except to note that the AAC logo actually was on the court last year. We won't see any obvious decline right away, but the likelihood of it happening over time is pretty high.
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linkster
Joined: 27 Jul 2012
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| Posted: 09/03/14 3:53 pm ::: Re: Someones having a bad day. |
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| Nixtreefan wrote: |
My question was - would a drop in ticket revenue greatly affect a school like Uconns budget or do they make enough money from other revenue!
Some schools have huge booster contributions! |
I would guess UConn is a light weight when it comes to booster's athletic donations. They did manage to pay for their $35 million basketball practice facility with donated funds.
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purduefanatic
Joined: 10 Aug 2011
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Location: Indiana
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| Posted: 09/04/14 8:50 am ::: |
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| beknighted wrote: |
| purduefanatic wrote: |
Well that's not quite true. The majority of TV revenue that a school generates is through the football deals with the networks & cable/satellite providers as well as the advertising dollars that something like the Big Ten Network gets from commercial slots. That money goes to benefit the entire athletic department. I know this money comes through the conference offices for the most part but it is generated mostly from football and men's basketball.
IMO, this is where UConn will eventually feel it in their "wallet". The AAC as constructed will NOT demand good money for the football product it produces and the basketball money will be limited as well.
I get a chuckle out of people that say that the change of conferences hasn't seemed to effect UConn yet. Well no kidding. It won't happen overnight and there hasn't even been a UConn basketball game played with the AAC logo on their court. The decline will be very minimal if at all with Geno at the helm...but when he retires, it's a whole new ball game. |
Football does tend to suck up a very high percentage of the revenue it generates - there are plenty of high-profile D-I programs that don't really make that much money from football when you do the accounting.
Anyway, I agree with your final point about UConn, except to note that the AAC logo actually was on the court last year. We won't see any obvious decline right away, but the likelihood of it happening over time is pretty high. |
Yes, football does suck up a lot of revenue, but I'm strictly talking about the 20+ million that every school in those leagues gets from the TV deals. The football programs certainly soak up every bit of the ticket sales, parking, concessions, clothing, etc that comes in as a result of the home games. That TV money gets used to offset what's left to cover for football but that leaves a pretty good chunk of money that then gets spent on the other sports. At least that has been my experience...none of the smaller sports are really left wanting for too much at these Power 5 schools.
And thank you for the correction on the AAC logo...I was actually thinking and meaning with this current lineup of schools.
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linkster
Joined: 27 Jul 2012
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| Posted: 09/04/14 11:16 am ::: |
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| purduefanatic wrote: |
I get a chuckle out of people that say that the change of conferences hasn't seemed to effect UConn yet. Well no kidding. It won't happen overnight and there hasn't even been a UConn basketball game played with the AAC logo on their court. The decline will be very minimal if at all with Geno at the helm...but when he retires, it's a whole new ball game. |
What I read is that it's the coach and not the conference that drives a program. I agree. And there have been several teams in big football conferences that slipped after the coach retired, even though they were in a high revenue conference.
As far as waxing nostalgic over the loss of games with PC & BC, I'm puzzled how these games went from being unwatchable and boring?
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GEF34
Joined: 23 Jul 2008
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| Posted: 09/05/14 1:44 am ::: |
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| linkster wrote: |
| purduefanatic wrote: |
I get a chuckle out of people that say that the change of conferences hasn't seemed to effect UConn yet. Well no kidding. It won't happen overnight and there hasn't even been a UConn basketball game played with the AAC logo on their court. The decline will be very minimal if at all with Geno at the helm...but when he retires, it's a whole new ball game. |
What I read is that it's the coach and not the conference that drives a program. I agree. And there have been several teams in big football conferences that slipped after the coach retired, even though they were in a high revenue conference.
As far as waxing nostalgic over the loss of games with PC & BC, I'm puzzled how these games went from being unwatchable and boring? |
I think it's a little of both a good coach can certainly sustain a good program regardless of conference, as you've seen schools in mid-major conferences sustain a good program for a prolonged period of time because of the coach. But at the same time I think the conference does take a toll at some point, especially with money, because it affects recruiting, travel expenses, etc.
I don't think Connecticut will be severely affected by the AAC because of the great coaching staff, and I think they should be able to still attract high level recruits because of the history of the program. But I could see in maybe 5-6 years some recruits having second thoughts about going to Connecticut if other conferences start increasing their TV coverage.
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005
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| Posted: 09/05/14 9:42 am ::: |
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I think that the mid-major conferences will probably expand their TV coverage as time goes on -- cable TV needs programming, and that's a cheap way to fill time.
UConn is an anomaly, though. As long as Geno's there, they probably won't drop off. But for most schools, not being in the Power Five (or whatever we call them now that the BCS is gone) would be a significant blow. Is Washington State really a better athletic destination than Utah State? But which will get the better recruits?
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